If you are not with us, you are against us!
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And this troll is just the latest. No matter what you say, what you do or what you write, no one on earth know the truth or can be correct except if you are a zionist. If you say you hate zionists, then you are accused of hating Jews and Israelis, and you are anti-semitic.
I don’t have to say much here, but thanks to the stupid Mobius for the traffic. Although it haven’t resulted in a single comment on any of my posts that he links to, which he like to describe as “Global Voices Online’s Antisemitic Middle East Editor“, what the f*ck is up with that? (mobius said)
Update: What is Zionism?
United Nation General Assembly Resolution 3379
RECALLING its resolution 1904 (XVIII) of 20 November 1963, proclaiming the United Nations Declaration on the Elimination of All Forms of Racial Discrimination, and in particular its affirmation that “any doctrine of racial differentiation or superiority is scientifically false, morally condemnable, socially unjust and dangerous” and its expression of alarm at “the manifestations of racial discrimination still in evidence in some areas in the world, some of which are imposed by certain Governments by means of legislative, administrative or other measures”,
RECALLING ALSO that, in its resolution 3151 G (XXVIII) of 14 December 1953, the General Assembly condemned, inter alia, the unholy alliance between South African racism and Zionism,
TAKING NOTE of the Declaration of Mexico on the Equality of Women and Their Contribution to Development and Peace 1975, proclaimed by the World Conference of the International Women’s Year, held at Mexico City from 19 June to 2 July 1975, which promulgated the principle that “international co-operation and peace require the achievement of national liberation and independence, the elimination of colonialism and neo-colonialism, foreign occupation, Zionism, apartheid and racial discrimination in all its forms, as well as the recognition of the dignity of peoples and their right to self-determination”,
TAKING NOTE ALSO of resolution 77 (XII) adopted by the Assembly of Heads of State and Government of the Organization of African Unity at its twelfth ordinary session, held at Kampala from 28 July to 1 August1975, which considered “that the racist regime in occupied Palestine and the racist regime in Zimbabwe and South Africa have a common imperialist origin, forming a whole and having the same racist structure and being organically linked in their policy aimed at repression of the dignity and integrity of the human being”,
TAKING NOTE ALSO of the Political Declaration and Strategy to Strengthen International Peace and Security and to Intensify Solidarity and Mutual Assistance among Non-Aligned Countries, adopted at the Conference of Ministers for Foreign Affairs of Non-Aligned Countries held at Lima from 25 to 30 August 1975, which most severely condemned Zionism as a threat to world peace and security and called upon all countries to oppose this racist and imperialist ideology,
DETERMINES that Zionism is a form of racism and racial discrimination.
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32 Comments on “If you are not with us, you are against us!”
if you hate zionists, that means you hate the vast majority of jews in the world who happen to be zionist. if you support suicide bombers and call them martyrs and support the rocketing of israeli towns, that means you support the murder of innocent civilians, which makes you an asshole. if you defend the remarks of the president of iran, who called for israel to be wiped off the face of the earth, by in turn selectively quoting a litany of zionists, that means you hate israel. if you hate israel that means you hate the people who comprise this democratic republic — because what is a democracy if not a government of the people? if you hate the people of israel, that means you hate me, and all my friends, who are fighting to put an end to the occupation and to elevate the rights and freedoms of palestinians in israel and the palestinian territories. it is not so easy to differentiate between jew/zionist/anti-occupation activist, you see. when you make sweeping statements about zionists, and you say, “it’s okay to fight and kill zionists,” you’re saying it’s okay to fight and kill most of the jews on earth.just so you know.and when you say it’s okay to fight and kill zionists, you’re saying it’s okay to fight and kill me — an american jew, who has moved to israel.if you’re saying it’s okay to kill me, all i can say is, fuck you.
There are people that will never see things rationally. I have a couple of that on my blog as well. Eventually you stop getting annoyed with them.
mobius, thanks for uncovering what you really are. A zionist asshole. That’s what you are.Trying to put words I didn’t say on my mouth is a poor style, which is not new from a racist person like you and all of those who believes in what you believe in, that is Zionist.If you have a brain, and if it is working correctly (which I doubt), then if you read all what you are referring to and come to this kind of conclusion, then you are a sick person and should see a doctor.Since you are impolite and you insist in using vulgar talk, I do not hesitate to ban you from commenting here. However, keep coming, I’m happy that all of this is upsetting you.
this is what I posted up on Mobius’s blog. Any attempt at painting Haitham or any of the Palestine bloggers as racist is wrong, and it is of course the standard ploy that many Zionists use simply because they will not address the content of the articles and the legitimate arguments behind them, rather resorting to insult, smear, gross generalisation and absurd propaganda. This is the standard procedure. I wonder what kind of blogs Mobius wants to see.. where they write that Palestinians are willing to renounce their rights because it’s what goes down well with the American (brainwashed) public? The US is not the centre of the world, and it is only a question of time when the issues of Palestine will ring so clearly to everyone who is made aware of them, and they will fight to overcome the racism and oppression just like they did when the came to awareness that something was rotten in South Africa. It is a matter of time, and presenting things without fear of “disturbing the sleep of the Zionists” and being able to tolerate the unfair and mechanical cries of “anti Semite!” is something that time and dedication gives us. Haitham is no racist, and as he says, if you read his blog, you will have to tell us if you like your crow cold or heated.
The post to Mobius’s blog.
Not only is Haitham an exceptionally generous, exceptionally kind person, and very talented in his creative activism, he is also morally limpid, and there is no racism in any of his communication. He, like most of the other Palestine Blogs handled on GVO, believe that the rights of Palestinians are sacrosanct, and that the way to achieve this is for mutual coexistence between “enemies”.
The first step of this is to listen to the grievances, to give them an opportunity to express that which they want to say, no matter how “politically correct” or popular those ideas may be. If the Palestinian street respects the Hamas, you pro-israeli bloggers must take stock of it and try to comphrend why, and what they believe that the Hamas can bring them that any other political organisation has not yet been able to do. Lest you forget, the Palestinians are still largely living in a condition of refugee status, many of them lacking even the most basic of rights that we take for granted. They have little guarantee for their security, and they have absolutely nothing but the opinion of masses of people behind them. There is no “Palestinian” ADL out there financed to spread information, news, opinions and propaganda.
You can state whatever you want about Israel, about Palestine, but when you go smearing those who support Palestine because they are not in your camp, it reflects worse upon yourself than on those you wish to ruin.
Trust me it’s very easy to differenciate between “jew/zionist/anti-occupation activist”. Just because you choose to be all of these together doesn’t mean you’re the model. There are jews all over the world who are against the Israeli occupation of Palestine, there are jews who aren’t zionists and there are fannatic zionists who don’t mind the palestinians being kicked out of their homes and put in jails and killed in tens every day. And yes, Zionism is clearly a form of racism and racial discrimination.
Keep up the good work Haitham. I’m so glad I found your blog. It’s truly informative.
Thanks, thecutter, Samia, Abu Sinan and all.
I just like to add one more idea to this zionist guy. See, I hate David Ben-Gurion, Haim Weizmann, Golda Meir, Menahem Begin, Yitzhak Shamir, Binyamin Netanyahu, Ehud Barak, and Ariel Sharon. Does this mean that I hate all Israelis and Jews and want them all to be killed? Of course not.
If you still think I do, then. Do you like Yassr Arafat, Abu Jihad, Abu Nidal, Mawran Al Barghothi, Ahmed Yaseen, Al Rantece, Mahmood Abbas, etc…? If you do, you are a liar. If you don’t, then using your methodology, can I suggest that you hate all Palestinians, Muslims and Christians, and you want then all to be killed?
Hi Haitham,
I hope you doing well. This my first time on your blog, and I Love it; no joke, keep up the good work.
Forget ziomaggot Mobius and pathetic crew of ziobloggers. They have NOTHING to say for themselves because at the of the day, Israel’s actions are indefensible. I’ll say it again. Israel has no leg to stand on, it is a police state to its people and an army terrorist state to Palestinians. Don’t take my words for it, I’m just a synthetic duck. See Amnesty, Human Rights Watch as a good starting point…
One thing I will concede to zionists, they are superb liars; even their highest academic, Dershowitz is a blatant plagariser and produces fakes like his book, “The case for Israel”, which is nothing less than hoax, a fake document; I would classify his book as art, meaning, not to be taken literally.
I agree Haitham, Mobius needs help but there is little he will find here.
Peace.
Hi Haitham, I hope you doing well. This my first time on your blog, and I Love it; no joke, keep up the good work.
Forget ziomaggot Mobius and pathetic crew of ziobloggers. They have NOTHING to say for themselves because at the of the day, Israel’s actions are indefensible. I’ll say it again. Israel has no leg to stand on, it is a police state to its people and an army terrorist state to Palestinians. Don’t take my words for it, I’m just a synthetic duck. See Amnesty, Human Rights Watch as a good starting point…
One thing I will concede to zionists, they are superb liars; even their highest academic, Dershowitz is a blatant plagariser and produces fakes like his book, “The case for Israel”, which is nothing less than hoax, a fake document; I would classify his book as art, meaning, not to be taken literally.
I agree Haitham, Mobius needs help but there is little he will find here.
Peace.
Hey Haitham, don’t mind the bastard he’s one of the victims of the new world order, which is basically creating more and more kinds of “if you’re not with us, you’re against us.”
If you look at terrorists, they have the same mentality, and so doest extreme right governments, such as the Bush administration and many of its followers, they are all on the same boat, but standing on different ends, yet going in the same direction.
The worst thing about this whole matter, is that all those extremists, no matter what kind they are, promote their extremism in the name of democracy, peace and creating a balanced world.
Zionists never cease to amaze me! they really have guts…
What possible justification do you as an American have to move to Israel when the indigenous inhabitants are denied by your government their inalienable right to return to their ancestral homes? Does anyone know where their ancestors lived two thousand years ago? And if you could state with certainty that they lived in a part of Palestine would your so-called historic rights have precedence over the civil and human rights of the indigenous population?
The Canaanites are an amalgamation of every ethnic group who has passed through Palestine for thousands of years. If one claims historic rights, the Egyptians, who had sovereignity in Palestine much longer than Jews, could stake more a claim to “return” to Palestine, as could the Seljuks, the Turks, and many other groups.
“If you hate the people of israel, that means you hate me, and all my friends, who are fighting to put an end to the occupation and to elevate the rights and freedoms of palestinians in israel and the palestinian territories.”
Enjoy your delusion that you are working for the elevation of “the rights and freedoms of palestinians [sic] in israel [sic] and the palestinian [sic] territories.” Your advocacy of colonial Zionism and your sophomoric attempt to smear a respected Palestinian who advocates for his people belie your self-congratulatory pronouncement.
Salam Haitham,
Mobius is his own worst enemy. An intellectual minnow swimming around in his own little puddle. Yes, your blog is provocative at times and so it should be. Do I agree with everything you write? Not always, but it does make me pause and question my own values and assumptions, for which I thank you. In Morocco my friends are Moslems and Jews and we all read your blog and thank you for it.
Mobius is below contempt. Not for being a Zionist, but simply for being stupid. Blog on!
SAMIR from The View From Fes.
By now you know that I have taken this issue up with Global Voices. They told me I should dialogue with you. Given the way you’ve treated Mobius, I am not inclined to give you the benefit of the doubt, but, for starters, please explain what your motivation was for posting something on your blog from an American neo-Nazi website.
Michael,
Put GVO aside. This is my space, my own, and has nothing to do with my job at GVO.
Having said that, I don’t have to justify what I say or post on my blog, for at the end, we don’t have to agree, otherwise, I guess we would not have seen all these blogs.
However, back to my motivation, I guess you already know now that I’m pro-Palestine, anti-zionist. Therefore, uncovering any of the pro-zionist lies is my business, which seems not to be digested by zionist, and this is expected.
Last, but not least, I have the right to ban any troll on my blog. mobius was one of them, and he was warned before. Some think that this is his first comment here, which is not true. Comments records are still there if someone like to search. On the other hand, if you like to know why I posted this or that, I guess you will find it more useful if you follow these links you and others complain about and read it and following comments. I’m sure if you do that it will answer all your question.
Anti-Zionist, yes. Pro new-Nazi, no. But the questions is not who published the report you don’t like. The question is, what was mentioned in it, is it true or not? I’m still seeking one person to answer. No body did. Instead, all kinds of accusations and trolls, and I guess anyone can see that on Jewschool post and the comments followed that post. But did anyone attempted to answer or convince those who read the report including me that what is written is wrong? The answer is, NO!
Anyway, why don’t you check the last argument here:
http://sabbah.biz/mt/archives/2005/09/03/bahrain-jews-we-have-more-in-common-than-you-think/
It just proves mobius claims are nothing but jumping from a hole he dug for himself.
Peace!
Guys/Gals, all of you up there. Thanks for your support.
Love you all :-)
Haitham…you’ve got a big Jew schnoz ya ugly bastard. Personally, I think that’s about all the time/effort I’d spent debunking any of your points. Now go ahead…ban my ass.
Don’t insult my intelligence and yours. People like me are not inclined to dignify stuff like the National Vanguard article by responding to it on any level. (For the record, it has been circulating around the internet for years now, and several parts of it are indeed inaccurate, because several of people on the list are not Jewish.) When people post quotes from the Qu’ran to prove Mohammed was a terrorist and a pedophile, do you react by engaging the person and disproving the thesis? If someone posted a collection of Hamas statements to suggest that all Palestinians are bloodthirsty terrorists who hate Jews, would you dignify that by responding to it with an academic cool-headed rebuttal?
So why the hell should I take the time to respond to something from a neo-Nazi website that attempts to prove the oldest and most rank kind of antisemitic canards about jews controlling the media and world finances, the kind of filthy stuff that has been responsible for my people getting slaughtered time and again in the past?
Listen, don’t justify a thing. But don’t expect me to give a rats’ ass about your situation when you have so little regard for mine that you post neo-Nazi garbage and are proud of it. Don’t expect me to buy your bullshit about being anti-Zionist and not being anti-Jewish when you so clearly are not willing to understand the difference between the two concepts.
And no, I’m not inclined to separate your GV work from your blog. One is, whether you intend it or not, a vehicle for promoting the other. Unless you are two people, you don’t merit such a fine distinction.
That’s your problem, Michael. Period!
shtreimel, I’m not going to ban ‘your ass’ at this time. Maybe it is good to show how pathetic it is.
Want to brighten your day, Haitham and friends. Go to this site: you will not be disappointed. There are still people out there who value human and civil rights and justice.
http://fatoldjewishguywholivesintheprojects.blogspot.com/2005/12/about-my-right-to-return.html
Haitham and friends, If you want to be immeasurably uplifted check out this post:
http://fatoldjewishguywholivesintheprojects.blogspot.com/2005/12/about-my-right-to-return.html
Man, you’re a jerk. My conscience is clear.
Michael, you are pathetic!
Salam Haitham,
I have recently started reading your blog and wanted to give you a shout-out of support and solidarity. I will hopefully return soon with more participation, just wanted to say hello this time around.
Stay strong, you know who you are and you know what you aren’t (unlike some people who try to bring you down).
Salam ya Lulu
Thanks for your support, and you are welcome all the time to participate.
Peace
Pathetic how? Because I dared to challenge you on your blog? You didn’t respond to anything I said. That’s truly pathetic.
On this page containing about 3600 words, the word “hate” appears 15 times. Though that may not seem very many, it takes just one occurrence to indicate what the problem is.
This counts for all sides involved in this unfortunate debacle. Indeed the fact that there ARE sides is the greatest tragedy of all.
Haitham first off, id like to thank you for the great effort you pour into your blog, im a long time reader and this si the first tiem I post anything. I would just like to state an opnion about Zionazism, Pun intended, I strongly believe that any dialouge with this line of thought is destined for failure, at the core of the beliefs of Zionazis, is the denial of the other, you simplydo not exist, and this is why I have never seen a Zionazi speak without using profanity or at least extremly aggresive demeaning language in whatever venue they speak with, or about arabs and specifically Palestinains, I have sat down and spoke one on one with many of them and I personally believe that you cannot hold a dialgue with an entity that does not believe you are worthy of exstance. The only thing they should know that since most jews today are zionists then it is the Jews responsibility to fix their issues and we should stop trying to prove to everyone that we dont hate jews and israelis, why shouldnt we despise them? They ultimatly are the tools used to destroy our civilisation, our very existance, why should be shy about despising them? they are not shy about hating you, talk to any of them and they will tell you how much they hate you, dont go far, read the comments on this blog, this is just the tip of the iceberg.
Again this is just my humble opnion.
Michael Says:
Contrary, not because you challenged me, it’s because non of you actually stop up to the challenge in responding to the post I wrote or quote. Instead, you and alike ignored the topic of discussion and started a flame war and personal trolls, which is really waste of time.
See, I don’t have to answer any question or justify anything. You are the occupier of my homeland, and it’s you (zionists) accused in the posts of dispute. Therefore, it’s you who should reply to accusations and defend yourself, not me. I hope this is clear.
Anyway, it is clear that we are going on circles. I accuse zionists of something, and I made my point. Someone get upset about it, and s/he run from answering and defending their position, instead divert to a propaganda which has no head or legs.
Therefore, if you have an answer or a reply or a different view to a post that upset you, feel free writing about it in your blog, and I’ll be more than happy to read and discuss.
Hello lakerfox,
Thanks for sharing your opinion.
While I agree with the first part about their style of dialogue, and zionists believe that we (Palestinian) do not exist, however I disagree with your last part.
Of course zionists are Jews (well 99.99% are), but fortunately Jews are not all zionists. I have said that before, and even have few posts about that only, which zionists like to disgrace in their continuous attempt to keep the gap wide between Jewish and rest of the world. Example of that is the Bahrain Jewish post, and my happiness in seeing a good example of how we can co-exist. Yet, a zionist like mobuis post a comments that talks about Jews being deported from Arab countries, as if I should feel guilty about that. My question to him (which started all this) was if he (as a zionist) feels the same about deporting Palestinians from their homeland. That was the spark which made him start all his crap and his gang and alike start calling me names and accusing me of being antisemitic, forgetting that I myself is Semitic like so many other millions and millions of Arabs (Muslims, Christians and Jews).
Having said all that, I still see that while zionists are dominating the Jewish society, yet there are other Jews who do
follow or believe in what zionist are advocating for. These are the people I’m counting on, and proud to be a friend of. After all, generalization is not correct. Just like the generalization that all Muslims and Arabs are terrorists, which is not true.
Anyway, I respect your opinion, and after all, diversity is welcomed, but superiority (zionism) is guaranteed to failure, sooner or later.
Interesting, I am not into the internet for much and this is the first blog I’ve been to (I think :). Thanks Haitham for an interesting bit of reading. My father’s father was Jewish, but I’m not. But I suppose I could be? Lakerfox, I think you should be careful not to generalize against Jews too much, while many, or most Jews (today) probably, are Zionist to some degree, and many rabidly, you risk making enemies out of the few that would otherwise sympathize with you if you hate all blindly. Don’t stoop to a lower level. There’s too much of that going on. I admire Haitham’s measured responses, and that should tell us all something. We are all attracted to intelligent, rational responses in the face of aggression, it makes us sympathize with that person and condemn the attacker. Brenner looks (is
) like a jerk compared to Haitham. Now the meat, or rationale behind the arguments should be more important, but don’t overlook the fact that emotionally we respond differently. So keep your anger to yourself and win people over to you. Then they will listen to your arguments. Hating isn’t the goal, it is the unfortunate symptom of an impossibly wrong situation, but you should be trying to get rid of the sympton even as you strive to fix the situation. Even, sometimes, your worst enemy, once you’ve calmed them down. Take care.