Freedom of Racism!
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Norwegian magazine has published the Prophet cartoons:
A Norwegian Christian magazine has published a set of controversial caricatures of the prophet Mohammed after months of uproar in the Muslim world over a Danish paper’s decision to print the same cartoons. Repeating a move by conservative Danish paper Jyllands-Posten last September, Magazinet published the controversial drawings in the name of ‘freedom of expression’ on Tuesday. Magazinet editor Vebjoern Selbekk said he was not afraid of the prospect of facing the same indignation and even death threats that faced the Danish paper after it published the cartoons. Meanwhile, Denmark’s prime minister on Tuesday accused a group of local Muslims of smearing the country’s reputation in the Middle East. Anders Fogh Rasmussen said he was ’stunned’ that leaders of the Islamic Faith Community had traveled to Egypt, Syria and Lebanon ‘to stir up attitudes against Denmark and Danes’, observing that ‘misinformation’ about Denmark had appeared in the Arab media after their tour of the Middle East. A spokesman for the Islamic Faith Community, contended that ‘We did nothing wrong by seeking help abroad and making use of our freedom of speech.’
“Freedom of speech.” Noble right used to conduct racist activities among many other controversial activities.
Last december, responding to a complaint by the Organization of Islamic Conferences (OIC) over the twelve caricatures of the prophet Mohammad published in the Danish newspaper Jyllands-Posten last September, Louise Arbour - United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights - has appointed two UN experts on racism to carry out a detailed investigation into what Arbour characterizes as a “disrespect for belief.”
Why did Jyllands-Posten publish the cartoons? The Copenhagen Post explains: “Jyllands-Posten called for and printed the cartoons by various Danish illustrators, after reports that artists were refusing to illustrate works about Islam, out of fear of fundamendalist retribution. The newspaper said it printed the cartoons as a test of whether Muslim fundamentalists had begun affecting the freedom of expression in Denmark.”
You see, when the Danish newspaper published these cartoons, they claimed they did that as a ‘test of whether Muslim fundamentalists had begun affecting the freedom of expression in Denmark.’ So, now I guess Norway wants to conduct the same test.
Just like someone ‘finger your ass‘ (excuse my French) and you are not suppose to react or even say ‘ouch’. It’s ‘freedom of expression’, and they express that the way they see it fit. But if you do the same, you will be called all names. So, don’t dare calling them racist!!
In case you never saw the Prophet Mohammad’s drawings:
Other posts on the same subject:
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145 Comments on “Freedom of Racism!”
Clearly there is no word in Arabic for hypocrite…after all the abuse they heap on others, it is pretty amazing that they can get so indignant when someone in another country pokes fun at them. I hope to see more cartoons and thank you for reprinting them!
I am even more amazed at the European and American bleeding hearts who defend the sensitivities of these fundamentalist Arab barbarians…these are medieval, racist, misogynistic folks…ask the Armenians or Sudanese or Kurds or Jews or Copts or women or … about Arab/Muslim tolerance of others!
Being judgemental is bad, but having no judgement is worse…the fundamentalist Muslims are a scary group and it is commendable that some Danes are brave enough to call them on it…I applaud you!
So, Dave says,
“…I am even more amazed at the European and American bleeding hearts who defend the sensitivities of these fundamentalist Arab barbarians…these are medieval, racist, misogynistic folks…ask the Armenians or Sudanese or Kurds or Jews or Copts or women or … about Arab/Muslim tolerance of others!…”
Let’s agree that the papers had a legitimate question in mind, that is, what would the reaction be if they published these twelve cartoons. Let’s say their interest was in determining how much flak any cartoonist would get for illustrating a book about the Muslim Prophet. By some reports, this was their stated intent. However, they should have anticipated just the kind of reaction they have recieved. They knew that all religious people have been sensitive to any kind of commentary about their beliefs. So, for example, the fundamentalist Christians seem to react in the same way in the United States when tv shows depict Jesus, however sympathetically to some people. There will be a lot of others who will scream, bitch, and moan, until the image or the show is pulled out of public sight.
Dave may have heard that when a cartoon was recently presented criticizing the war effort, several military officers decided the cartoon insulted the soldiers who have been woulded themselves. It is not just religious people who have been sensitive.
So, is Dave advocating that we not be sensitive to the people who have said they’ve been hurt by such cartooning? Or, is Dave saying just we should not care to understand or sympathize with Muslims?
I still have a lot of questions I’d like answered about these cartoons because they do not seem to be designed to just test the waters of Muslim sensibilities. That is, as I’ve tried to point out, they are most all the kind of images that criticize the Muslim religiuon for being only interested in bombs , violence, repression, and so forth. Of course these kind of images would rattle a lot of cages.
Why put out such one sided cartoons all with the same kind of cranky tone? I suspect there may have been the expectation that the Muslim community would react just as it has done. This seems just what some people would want who wanted to have westerners think the Muslim community was a cranky intolerant sort.
So, I may just be interested in determining why such cartooning was published. Maybe it was done, not just to investigate whether it would be safe to illustrate Muslim children’s books, but to provoke the kind of response that came about, because that kind of response would be expected and useful.
I think one thing we all could do is try to understand just what these pepaers were trying to do. Is it true that they were trying to find out whether it would be “safe” to illustrate books? Would they have used these cartoons to illustrate chidren’s books about the Prophet? I doubt it.
One more comment about Dave’s piece. I am not sure that the same people who were responsible for the problems with Armenians, the Sudanese, the Kurds, Jews, or Copts, are the same people who are now hurt by these cartoons. Dave seems to be suggesting that the fact that some Muslims might have been involved in some crime, we need not thereafter ever have to be concerned to understand Muslims or have respect for them ever again. This sounds fairly irrational to me. But, is Dave really suggesting such a radical and criminal policy?
I hear much about Muslims demanding “respect” in this matter. One the prerequisites to being respected is (surprise) being respectable.
Look at these Muslims up in arms over a handful of drawings. Their reactions. Their words. Their deeds. Indeed, their entire contribution as a people and a culture to this generation of humanity on Earth.
I ask you, is this behavior respectable? Nay. Respect where respect is due. A people such as this are deserving of as much contempt as the civilized world can muster.
Muslims in general and especialle in the Muslim world will not have gained respect in the west by their reaction. The boycot was fine and it did set things in motion but the threats and flagburning will have leave most westerners less trusting of the Muslim communities. Now everybody will worry that they might do something with out knowing it that will cause muslims to explode in anger and this will not bring them closer to each other.
ps: At this point I dont know how many of the Muslims agreed with this behavior but I really hope its ridiculously few.
The fact that according to Islamic religion the bare depiction of Mohamed in painting or drawing is sinful and derogatory is not something that a secular, Independent newspaper needs to take into account. If Muslims feel its wrong to draw pictures of their prophet no one is forcing then to do so. But they cannot force their religion upon others. Jews feel it is sinful and wrong to make any attempt at painting god and you will never find a religious Jew who will tell you differently but do they forbid the rest of the world to do so? Although Islam has adopted the historical figure of Mohamed as a religious figure and has chosen to worship him as their prophet it does not mean that Islam now has a monopoly over him. He was a human who actually lived on this earth. He is part of the human history and the bare fact that Muslims believe in him will not stop me from using his figure and his life’s story as I whish. Mohamed belongs to humanity just as any other piece of our history. Our depiction of his figure does not mean that we do not respect Islam; it only means that we are not Muslim.
Where does the idea for cartoons and caricatures derive from? It derives from an effort to criticize a certain idea or opinion through the use of drawing rather than words. It is a practice that has been around for hundreds of years if not more and has always been regarded as a harsher form of critical expression than words wove into a sentence for no real reason other than human natural subjectivity and the fact that the pictures can be seen and understood universally while an article requires the understanding of the language and the patience to sit and read it. However, this does not change the fact that words can and usually are the harsher from of criticism. More so in this case, there are countless books, articles, academic studies- and what not- whose criticism towards Islam or the Arab culture is by far more slandering and humiliating than those poor cartoons. Is the expression of criticism towards Islam wrong by itself? Is criticism towards any religion wrong? I think not. All religions are an attempt at explaining life and the universe. Any religion is a theory about the origin of the universe, about life and the reason for it. I don’t understand why people insist on trying to make religion into something sacred, holy, and untouchable even when they don’t believe in it themselves. When a professor describes a scientific theory that he believes to be correct do we cringe from expressing disagreement? From criticizing? Religion is no different and should not be treated differently. If I disagree I will criticize and make known my disagreement in all forms at my disposal including, writing, verbal expression and drawing cartoons.
Terrorist are people that create fear by use of violence.
Since some these muslims reacted with such violence(burning flags, assulting embassies & even calling for Bin Laden) to ‘offensive’ articles crticising them or whatever, does that put all those protesters and whoever calling for violence very much in line with the Terrorist’s idology?
I am sure if ‘they’ could get their hands on bombs or boeing 747, some place(usually Western ones) would be a target soon?
I think it is a sad day for all Islam when such violent demonstrations can be invoked over a few peoples ignorant cartoons. This is exactly why the west is so confused over our religion, and will never truly except us. There are far too many that will burn a flag, or kidnap a foreigner, or worse, execute them, for cartoons?
How much worse is it to condemn a whole country, burn their embassy to the ground, hold hostage their citizens that have been kidnaped, run through the streets chanting death threats, all for the cartoons that these few people are responsible for? In doing so, we do not solve the problem, but merely justify the ridicule. This shows the west a very unstable populace, that can easily be invoked to violence. One day your friend, trying to build relationships both political as well as opening trade for growth, a key step in the acceptance and recognition of legitimacy as a true nation. And the next you have these same people burning your buildings down because of what a news paper has done. How could a relationship of trust from Nation to Nation ever flourish in that kind of unstable, unpredictable, violence?
That would be like all of the Christians in the world demonstrating, kidnaping, killing, burning, chanting in the streets death to all of Islam for what a very few have done in the name of Islam.
I agree that there have been horrible deeds perpetrated against us both in the past, as well as on going atrocities around the globe. But these wrongs done to us are being done by Governments, policies, and military actions that attempt to justify the air strike of a religious gathering for whom they believe to be inside. Not by the people of these nations themselves.
In fact, I have never been to a country who’s citizens have been more accepting of my faith than the United States. They even have strict, powerful laws that protect me from what is called “Hate Crimes” that makes it a felony to even threaten me because of my faith. There are not, nor will there ever be similar laws, that are enforced with such clarity, protecting Christians in any Arab country.
I am not advocating the acceptance of its government, but neither am I acceptable to the idea that we should chop the heads off of the innocents because of what a few are responsible for.
Do you not see the contradictions that we show? In the eyes of the world, Islam is fast becoming a religion of hatred and violence, and we hurt our cause of the acceptance of the truth because of it.
So go ahead, burn an embassy, stomp on a flag that represents an entire people, not just the few that may ridicule us, kidnap a reporter, chop a few heads off. You imbeciles. You are doing more damage to me, to the truth, every time I try to share my faith, or attempt to convert someone, than a thousand of such cartoons, and I pray that someday you will be held responsible for the damage that you perpetrate to our faith.
It is all a pretext for a third khalifat.
Why did you come to Europe?
What would happen to me if I(a jewish atheist) will go Syria?
It is better to draw than to cut non-muslims heads.
Thanks to nonexistent god we are stronger and can stop your human hating
Propaganda that sells as religious believes.
to all those of you who do NOT know what islam is all about make sure you step aside and don’t even criticise. first of all if you think that islam is THE ONLY RELIGION THAT HAS BEEN CHOPPING OFF HEADS OR CAUSING TERROR THEN YOU ARE DEAD WRONG. did you forget about jail “abu ghoreib” in Iraq what the soldiers had done to the prisoners? did you totally forget about antoine who happens to be a christian by the way and his followers who have been smuggling weapons to assassinate american soldiers? i guess you really have no idea what you are talking about. terrorists are those who do not fear god or even believe in him…there is a HUGE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MUSLIMS AND TERRORISTS so please amanda make sure you use better language and more understanding as well as more education before stating your opinion
YA RIGHT SASHA YOU KNOW IT ALL. if u were a jewish person YOU WOULDN’T BE ABLE TO EVEN ENTER SYRIA SO WHAT ARE YOU EVEN TALKING ABOUT? come people just make a little more sense
Iran this is to you too: you were mentioning all the negative facts about Moslems or arabs. 1. iran is NOT THE ONLY COUNTRY WHO HAS WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION I DONT KNOW IF YOU KNOW THAT KOREA HAS SOME, RUSSIA AS WELL AS JAPAN…OH SORRY I FORGOT HOW UNEDUCATED SOME OF YOU ARE. 2. increase of unemployment? did you ever take a look at the economy or daily life of many americans? germans? french people? 3.increase in crime rate? oh ya did u ever watch reality tv or discovery channel? i guess you dont even know what that is. well if you make sure you check out the documentaries they have about america’s daily crimes. 4. Selling Iranian women as sex slaves in the United Arab Emarets?????? excuse me but then you havent heard of the abuse of children particularly FEMALES who happened to be sold everyday in some of canada’s regions or america’s…..again i repeat seems like you know nothing about that too…..so make sure you read a little bit more and watch important documentaries that would help develop your WIDE KNOWLEDGE
i have been interested in reading all of your commands since being a lawyer requires to defend that opinion and right which is worth to be defended…talking about my own pt of view. i, as a lawyer think that ppl who dont have an idea bout the islam should keep their opinion 2 themselves…ive lived all religions and i’m a moslem…it is very wrong to judge a religion specially when we talk about “ISLAM” this is the only religion which is based on peace,love etc. Moslems r not terrorists as u all ” UNEDUCATED” ppl say.. we,the moslems never ever judged the jews or the christians bcoz every1 has his own religion but 2 start drawin caricatures bout our prophet mohammad pbuh. dont any judge our religion!!! y dont u make fun of the buddhists? or the ppl who worship the cow??? u dont and ul never do that bcoz theyr unimportant religions …UNLIKE ISLAM and all religions know that islam is the one religion which is totally correct…this is all a trick …the denish ppl is tryin 2 provoke us ( the islam) so that we fight back 2 defend our religion and then theyr gonna say huh u see only bcoz if a caricature ur makein such a big deal and that we proved that we r terrorists and if we stay quiet about this mess they say that we r losers or weak or smth like that…well WE WILL NOT STAY QUIET AND LAUGH ABOUT THIS WE HAVE TO STAND UP AND FIGHT FOR OUR RELIGION BCOZ NOONE JUDGES US-WE HAVE OUR OWN JUDGE “ALLAH” AND HE WILL AND NOT ANY STUPID OR SILLY PPL WHO THINK THEYR MIGHTY OR POWERFUL ALLAH WILL SHOW ALL PPL WHO IS RIGHT AND WHO IS WRONG !!! When the world is near judgement day we will all inshallah ya rab look at u down to earth while we are sittin in heaven !!! ALLAH W AKBAR W OUR PROPHET MOHAMMAD PBUH !!! so u all really better stay quiet and watch us standing up to fight for peace which is a word other religions will never get to know..
I believe Gin (in post #127) is a true ambassador for Islam.
The last line of his/her submission speaks volumes about his/her faith and the “so u all better stay quiet” bit is a wonderful example of exhibited willingness to listen to and digest other points of view in a peaceful way.
Also, the rampant use of capital letters and multiple puncuation marks does not in any way suggest any form of insecurity, I’m sure.
Well, that seems very hard to argue with. I do agree with you on many points, but unfortunately, it is a very complicated problem, and will not be solved here. I do find it very disturbing that many of our faith are so very quick to violence, often stirred to flames by the ones that are behind the scenes. It only portrays a front similar to wild beasts being goaded into violent tantrums by the rattling of a cage. Very unfortunate. Very disturbing future for all of Islam because of the ignorance of the masses in the middle east. I would hazzard a guess that things of this very nature will be the undoing of years of progress towards the establishment of a Palestinian state. Keep the faith my brother.
Looks like someone FINALLY found the right Muslim button to push for self distruction, it’s called a cartoon of there leader. There is a God
And yes, I do agree with you 128, people like that only serve to stoke the flames higher. Allah be willing, all such judgmental view points will be shown as mere human anger towards persicution that should be welcomed, for the treasures that it will earn in heaven.
But I do understand such anger, it is a challenge on a daily basis to persevere and over come our human skin. The true teachings show us that when we succumb to such petty human emotions evoked by something as simple as a cartoon, while we may whole heartedly disagree with it, such violent out bursts only show how many that claim to be Muslims, are only lost sheep, and insecure of their faith.
Oh goodness, I have only just read 122, from mac. I believe that you have hit upon a truth my friend.
I wasn’t aware that Islam is considered a Race. Racism only applies to denigration of someones ethnic background. Muslims may be of any race or national background. A person who ridicules anothers Religion could better be described as a bigot. However most likely the perpetrators of this incident probably aren’t affiliated with any religion. They are most likely Athiests.
Personally, I find the burning of my nations flag - seemingly a daily ritual in muslim countries - to be a deeply offensive assault on my cherished institutions, traditions and secular values. Yet, I, like the vast majority of those in the west, would fight to maintain the right to engage in such expression, even by offended Muslims. Similarly, I’m reminded of the art exhibit in the U.S. several years ago featuring a piece depicting a crucifix submerged in urine. Although many Christians and others urged a narrow boycott of the exhibit and also questioned the expenditure of tax dollars on controversial art, I don’t recall a single voice calling for the artist’s death. Indeed, on a daily basis, one can find extreme examples of political and social criticism affecting every quarter of society in the West; nevetheless, we choose to endure or ignore the offensive noises on the fringe for the sake of an overarching principle. But the Muslim world now demands sweeping apologies from various governments (none directly responsible), invokes an absolute immunity from the free expression of criticism in the West in any form, and, of course, pulls their inevitable trump card of threatened violence and death to the entire Western civilization. In shocking contrast, the utter silence of this supposed sensitive and tolerant muslim world spoke volumes in the immediate aftermath of 9/11, the Madrid bombings, the London bombings, the Malaysia bombings, the Paris riots, and Iran’s recent denial of the Holocaust (atually, mere tacit approval was a kind blessing compared to the overt celebrations througout Islam). Now, to compound this hypocrisy, the irony of the fact that these blustering threats and outrageous reactions literaly breath life into the silly caricatures at issue is lost on these people. As justification, many of the entries in this forum seek to draw a line between acceptable political criticism and blind respect for “religous belief.” This distinction, however, ignores the fact that Islam does not recognize any boundry between religion and politics. In sum, Islam attempts to define political, ethical and social policy across the board. Islam is not simply about deeply held personal convictions, which arguably may be entitled to some special deference and respect within the public forum. Rather, it manifests as multiple theocracies and currently shapes an aggressive emerging world view. Its consistency lies in its regressive, intolerant, entitled and ultimately violent ideology. One obvious symptom is its complete inability to deal rationally and reasonably with a relatively benign political cartoon. This behaviour isn’t just pathetic, its dangerous. Which, of course, brings us back to the legitimate point of the offending cartoons.
I UNDERSTAND THE HURT THAT MUST HAVE BEEN FELT BY SOME BY THE CARTOONS, BUT IS THE APPROPRIATE RESPONSE TO BURN THE DANISH EMBASSY. I HAD BEEN IN SAUDI FOR SIX MONTHS AS A SOLDIER IN 1991. WE WERE BRIEFED ON THE CUSTOMS, ESPECIALLY ABOUT THE LOWER CLASS TREATMENT AND VIEWS OF WOMEN. VERY QUICKLY I SAW THAT WAS TRUE, AND I DIID MY BEST TO ABIDE BY SAUDI CUSTOM. MY CROSS WAS ALWAYS HIDDEN AS ANYTHING BUT ISLAM IS ILLEGAL, I ALWAYS HAD A MALE ESCORT WHEN OUT OF THE COMPOUND, I STILL HAVE AN ABIA THAT I WORE IN THE TOWNS. IN RETURN MANY SAUDI MEN WOULD TRY TO GRAB AND PAW AT ME EVEN WITH THE MALE ESCORT IF THEY WEREN’T RIGHT NEXT TO ME. I AM NOT PROMISCUOUS, NEVER WAS, THE THANKS I RECIEVED WAS DEHUMANIZING HUMILIATION, OFTEN. HERE EVERYONE HAS THE FREEDOM OF RELIGION, FREEDOM OF SPEECH, YES THERE HAVE BEEN CARTOONS INSULTING TO THE CHRISTIAN RELIGION, THE JEWISH RELIGION PRINTED LOCALLY. THE WAS SOME FUSS, BUT NOT VIOLENCE,NOT DEATH THREATS. PEOPLE DON’T UNDERSTAND THE ISLAMIC RELIGION, BUT WHY WOULD THEY WANT TO WHEN IN THE NAME OF ALLAH VIOLENCE AND KILLING IS COMMONPLACE? IT’S ON THE NEWS DAILY, I DIDN’T SEE ANY MUSLIMS STANDING UP FOR THE JEWISH PEOPLE IN ISREAL, WHEN AFTER LEAVING THE GAZA STRIP, THEY WERE ONCE AGAIN ATTACKED. WWII THE DANES SAVED THE MAJORITY OF THE NONCHRISTIAN PEOPLE IN THEIR COUNTRY BY SMUGGLING THEM OUT OR HIDING THEM. THE CARTOONS WERE OFFENSIVE, BUT THE IMAGE BEING PORTRAYED TO THE WORLD FROM THE MIDDLE EAST DOESN’T GIVE A SPARKLING PICTURE OF A UTOPIAN WORLD. ACTIONS REFLECT THE PERSON AND COMMUNITY.
Thank you for posting the “Mohammad” cartoons
so I could see for myself what all the fuss is about
that would trigger rioting agaist the Danish and French
embassies.
My opinion of the cartoon of the head with the
skull in the shape of a bomb is utterly offensive,
for the reason that the cartoonist included the
Qu’ranic symbol of the “Greatest”. The cartoonist is a total
idiot. I do not think this cartoon falls under the protections
of freedom of speech–and obviously, he is not free to be so stupid, either.
I live in America. If a cartoon had been scripted of a
Klu Klux Klansman lynching a “Negro” (African American)
on the steps of the U.S. Capital Building under the American
flag, it would not be tolerated as freedom of speech. Likewise,
this cartoon with the bomb for a head should not be tolerated either.
The claim that the Dane’s were testing whether “freedom of speech” is being quelched by Muslims living in Denmark is hogwash. Why the Danes would want to meddle in the affairs of
the Moslems is surprising to me. I am thinking that this is another one of those situations where George Bush & Co. have paid
some idiot a huge sum of money to do their dirty work.
While I do not believe in violence, I can hardly blame the
Arab world for not sitting back and taking this abuse.
Why don’t people leave the Arabs alone. Aren’t they suffering enough. There is an old saying that I was told when living in Morocco years ago reflecting the Arab, hich is as follows:
An Arab will give a stranger in need the shirt off his back, even if it is the only one he owns. But if deceived, the Arab will strike with all of his might. Arabs are the most hospitable people
I learned when living among them in Morocco and in Israel/Palestine. Perhaps, the cartoonist, and the rest of the
ignoramouses, should take an internship into the Arab world and find this out for themselves. Ooops, it may be too late anymore
now as I am sure the good ol’ days of the indigenous Arab may be a thing of the past. I hope not, because this would be truly a enourmous loss to all of us around the world; equal to the extinction of the whale or the dolphin or the elephant or the bald eagle.
Thank you.
H. Mizrahi
well i have read most of the comments n have seen how every1 is saying it from his point of view but the most important thing is that the ones who don’t know what Islam is n don’t have any idea of what it talks bout they should not give any comments coz one must have the least amount of knowledge n information bout Islam to have the right to comment bout it n give his opinion so first u must know what ur talking bout to have the right to criticize it. that is for the ones who don’t know what Islam is.n for the ones that r sayin its freedom of speech n freedom to talk n give opinions well i say for them that they r 100% right n im 100% with freedom of speech n believe but r u all sure that this is wat is happenin??? well i will give u a small example of freedom of speech i think that u all know how France is with freedom of speech n believe n how France is always with democracy, well a small example is that a big French writer wrote a book in which he said that the hollacoster(when Jewish people were burnt in hitlers time)he said that it was all a lie n it is a way so that people can b emotional with the Jewish n all of that, well do u know what happened to him bcoz he said his opinion in such a thing? he is now in jail for FREEDOM OF SPEECH that u r all talking bout, so when it is against Jewish there is no freedom of speech, I see. And another example is the manar TV(which is an Islamic tv n is what Israel is doin in Palestine)well y is manar TV forbidden in America n in Europe since u all believe in freedom of speech????? Give me some answers for that can u??? so there is no such a thing of freedom of speech n if there is something called freedom then it should b applied on every1 not just groups of people, don’t u think???
Now for the ones who liked the cartoons bout prophet Mohammed, well all that u can think bout is that Muslims r terrorists, do u know what Muslim religion is n what Islam is???well let me tell u that also Muslims r against what is done in the name of Islam n that is not Islam n what is done in the name of Islam is everything but Islam n u would have known that if u know what Islam is n what prophet Mohammed says wont u???And another thing is that y do u think that for example bin laden or saddam or zarkawi r workin in the name of islam???r u all sure of these peoples backgrounds???well let me give u some information bout them….bin laden worked for the CIA most of his life n the CIA is the one who sent him to Afghanistan, and something else is,do u know y bin laden family was never investigated with??? well I will tell u y ,it is bcoz bin laden family is really close to Bush(the American president) since they have companies 2gether n since Bush n bin ladens work 2gether in petrol n gas.so don’t u see the irony in that???? N in Saddams case well America is the one who helped saddam to get to that place that he was b4 n America is the one who gave saddam his power,n u would know that if u just see farther than ur nose wont u??? so this whole campaign against Muslims n all the talk n work to make Muslims look like terrorists is just done by the ones who want Muslims to look like terrorists not by Muslims coz if u know what Islam is then u would seen that obvious that Islam themselves are against what is done in the name of Islam.And terrorists like binladen or saddam they r just an American project that went wrong in a place n they r just a tool to make the world against Muslims….
And some of u said that Islam is against other religions n against Jewish n Christians ,well I just want to ask those people from where did they get such information n did they ever live with true Muslims or even known true Muslims that r against other religion????well I wont talk alot bout this subject I will just give a line of what prophet mohammed said n what Islam say:LAKUM DYNUKUM WA LY DYNI,n that means that u have ur own religion n I have my own religion n I have no right to hate u or even look at u in a wrong way bcoz of ur religion .that is just a small idea of what Islam is…
Im just saying that u all must know what u r talking about n not just say things u don’t even know what it is n believe me when I say that the media will not provide u with what u need to know, the only way to get to know things is by knowing people not just by watching TV, coz as u will c u will believe n what would make u sure of that what u r watching is right??alot of groups want to make Muslims look bad n terrorists for their own sake so u must not believe everything u hear..n another example is that u know how blacks were killed n hated bcoz of their colour n that was all done in the name of Christianity n also how Jesus was hated in the name of Jewish ,so do u think all Christians r bad n all Jewish r bad???i don’t think so…
The point is that u cant judge a whole religion based on some groups that the religion itself is against.so if some people kill in the name of Islam that does not make all Muslims terrorists, the same thing if a Christian kills in the name of Christianity that does not make all Christians terrorists. If u want to live in peace then u must accept the people around u n respect their believes.
Peace on u all n hope that my message was clear……
Does Islam equate with hate, fear, insecurity, violence and zombie-like obedience?
I wonder if this is the conclusion drawn by the West now more than ever.
And I wonder if such conclusions are truly unfounded…
For years (since 2001 at least)it has been said that the West should get to know “true” Islam before any judgements are made.
Islam is now advertising itself for everyone’s consideration once again.
“The face of Islam” is now on the BBC, SKY, CNN and FoxNews for all to see…yet again.
I wonder what the verdict now will be.
Many will not care, though all truly should.
I remember seeing cartoons mocking 9/11, Madrid train bombing, the London bus bombing and the victims of the Bali bombings, and nobody in the Muslim world openly denounced them. In fact, there are daily anti-Semitic cartoon in the Arab papers and no Muslim has ever openly criticized them. If it’s okay to mock what’s precious to others, then it should be okay to do the same with what’s precious to the Moslems. After all, most Moslems who immigrate to the West do so in part because of freedom, including freedom of expression, which is part of what it means to live in a democratic country. It’s really unfortunate to see the Islamic radicals hijack the religion and forcefully suppress the voices of moderate and secular Moslems who believe in the values of democracy.
For the record Haitham: Islam is not a race and, as such, the title of your blog is curious.
Perhaps you find such an unfounded charge inflammatory. I do.
Exagerations such as these have lead to riots in the streets.
Were you hoping to add fuel to the fire here?
Is that a responsible thing to do?
i totally agree with with whatever you say ali # 141 and i have no commend on what hicham has said because ali has replied fair enough. i also think that you hicham should make sure again who has caused the 9/11 attacks. if u dont know much about that subject then i ask u not to open it because it seems to be not of your concern. if you woould like to know more about that subject go back to what I-H-O # 138 has said cuz he explains it all. and if after that you dont seem to have understood; then make sure you surrender instead of (quoting ali again) “adding fuel to the fire”
#141 Ali,
I guess you are talking to #140 Hicham, not me!? Otherwise, I lost you, I can’t get what you are talking about here!
Assalam_O-Alaikum,:
U all muslims just listen one thing that if you all muslims will be not felt any kind of regret and dpression after seeing al these kind of rubbish illussions and offensive characerters of Prophet(P.B.U.H)
then mark my words that when u will face live after death then God will be annoyed by all of those who did not raised up against these kind of offenive actions of kaffir(west/Europe),so u must understood one more thing that I am Osama ladin who is always ready to fight with these kaffirs but I am ashamed of the muslims like u or anyone who just talk and feel easy and take no reaction atleat neither feel unrest of souls so that a curse on Muslims like you type God will bless u all my child and will gave u all a responsible mind and thought to take a revenge / reacted against these kind of offensaive rubbish Fe-Aman-Allah……
Your not too bright 144, but then, neither are the people that are demonstrating and rioting over a few cartoons. They burned the wrong embassy. The Chilean embassy, located on the first floor in the same building as the Danish mission, was damaged in Saturday’s attack. The fire did not appear to touch the Swedish embassy located on the second floor, nor the Danish embassy on the third. I guess the Chileans can start rioting now, if they wanted to.
Time to teach those idiot a good lesson ,who is a boss?
Time to press a button !!!!!! Do it!!!
Agree……it is things like this that people that know nothing of Islam have left, at the end of the day, to judge by.
First the Moslems on this page say “the world does not understand” Islam and have “no intention of understanding”. Then when they have the chance to explain, they say it is “laughable… the Moslem world should explain itself for better understanding”.
Here is what the non-Moslems are explaining on American websites:
1. Moslems think the pictures say Islam is a violent religion. So, instead of saying, “Islam is not a violent religion”, the Moslems say “we will kill you.”
2. Moslems do not make pictures of the Prophet. But there are many pictures of the prophet in Moslem countries, so not all Moslems agree about this.
3.The Danish paper had 12 pictures, but 15 pictures went to the Middle East. The 3 extra pictures were very bad. Someone put in 3 more pictures to make trouble.
4. Follow the money. Bush’s Saudi friends want to replace Danish butter with Saudi butter. That’s why Bush is very quick to say he was against the Danish pictures. Bush’s Saudi friends will get more money. It is not about Islam; it is about money.
You see, if the Moslems do not say what they think, other people will say what Moslems think.
#121 Leen,
Yes, we do not read the koran or do not know the teachings of koran. but the actions of muslims are the stuff that reflects what they(or you) believe.
I don’t like the cartoons, and I think muslims have every right to protest. but comparing the intensity of the objections and unhappiness of the cartoons, they are far greater than the reaction to the torture at the prison and also at 911(in fact some celebrated).
so does this implicate an association with violence?
Houston, can you hear me??!!!
We found Osama Bin Laden.
quick, track his IP.
anti arab cartoons are in Israel newspaper too. Not a single Arab newspaper will ever published Moses.That’s the crux here.
Take a look at Hollywood.Arabs= terorists.
No Arabs went to street for that of course.
Regarding Posts 141 and 143:
Why so coy Haitham?
I think my point was rather clearly stated. I referenced the fact that you have given this thread the name “freedom of racism”…yet Islam is not a race.
The contradiction there is self-evident.
Again I will ask- are you simply trying to add fuel to the fire (”racism” is a rather caustic choice of words) with this baseless charge?
Is this the responsible thing to do?
Not trying to add fuel to anything, Ali. I think if you follow my blog well, and read more posts of mine about this subject (here, here and here); you will understand my views and opinion.
On the other hand, as you can see here, at some point, I just stopped commenting and left the door open for all to correspond (something we usually don’t have the right to practice – freedom of expression). It’s now clear that this has built some bases for understanding to some from both sides beside the normal expected rants and trolls. So, no harm done.
dear raeda,
promising virgins in paradise after being blown to pieces in earth sounds con enough to me.
LET’S DO WHAT WE ARE ON EARTH TO DO AND DON”T WASTE TIME READING OR WRITING WHAT IS USELESS.
stop the protests.thats what is useless
Thank you for your measured response, Haitham.
I agree that the freedom of expression is indeed an important one. And you’ve certainly proven that with your displays of the cartoons in question here.
Though you again haven’t addressed my point about Islam not being a “race” per se.
I’m afraid your cries of “racism” still seem well put of bounds here.
It seems that there is a difference between “leaving a door open” and instigating agitation.
But then, that is just my opinion I suppose.
Comment to 138:
I agree that most westerners dont know much about islam but are you actually implying that you have to be a muslim or an Islam expert just to give an oppinion on the matter. I realise denmark is a small country but I´ve seen an amazing amount of ignorence from many people on this blog who dont have faintets idea what kind of a country Denmark is and who probably dont care. But just to help those people out I would like to give a few basic facts that might stop people from making to many erroneous assumptions.
Denmark is probably the most secular country in the world therefore we tend redicuel all religion.
Burning the Koran in public would be illegal in Danmark.
Slanter and blasfemy is illegal (but its up to the courts, so if you have a complaint you will have to wait).
Many danes including myself thought the drawings were an unneccary and childish abuse of the freedom of expression
Most danish muslims are tired of the conflict and think the reaction has been groosly exagurated.
I hear that Iran is sanctioning caricatures of western Gods to see how the west responds. Be assured that will will not respond by threatening your buildings or defile your environment. We will not take to the streets and chant immorally against you. Also, we will not pray for your death or burn your flags. In the west we respect your right to opine. You act like savages when you take to the streets and wish death upon others. Surely your religion is better than that. Some of you will suggest that it is only the extremist and radicals that do so. There seem to be a lot of them. They need to be reigned in for your religion in the Muslim world appears to have a lot of haters in it and it is being misrepresented therefore to the world. I respect your religion personally but it needs to represent something good and decent.
Robert you seem to misjudge the acts of the west when something like that would actually happen. you say that YOU HEARD iran would want to sanction the western gods, but please make sure before hearing anything since propaganda and rumors play a huge role in daily life now a days. please make sure you do not speak in the name of “we” (quoting you again ” we will not respond by threatening your buildings or defile your environment. We will not take to the streets and chant immorally against you”) since you can not predict what or how western countries would reply. anyhow, they do not have to lead riots or demonstrations to advocate themselves, they can set sanctions whether economically or militarily. taking action on something does not always have to be with demonstrations or burning down buildings. they might as well be worse ( if you know what i mean) or less of value.
please reconsider # 172
Leen you make some good points regarding retaliation from the west. It can take the form of other sanctions that might be more clandestine but nefarious in nature. Also understand that there is a lot of propaganda against the west in many Muslim countries. The west is depicted very negatively. It is essentially a clash of cultures. Our view diverges from yours perhaps in how we see the world and religion most importantly. I just want there to be more tolerance and dignity in how we treat each others. There is too much separation and division in the name of religion and other factors. Personally I am very disappointed in the rulers of the world to include our president. From my point of view there seems to be very little tolerance from Muslim countries. Now we have Hamas in power in Palestine. Yes, according to what I read here in the west they are a terrorist group. They refuse to acknowledge Israel along with Iran. Both countries want to destroy it. Their speech is full of hatred. How do the Muslim countries justify that sort of conduct? When I turn on the television all I see or am allowed to see is hatred being heaped in bushels toward our president or western countries by Muslims. It is enough already. Can’t we all just get along? What is it going to take-World War III? I hope not.
also ihr penner, ich versteh net so janz wolum es hier jet aber ick weis das ihr alle gut furzen koennt ey? mein name ist joachim der 799. wenn ihr was braucht NIX VERGESSEN nur melden bei mick. alle klo? bis donn ihr kugelwarzen. adios batatos
na ihr rassistischen wix-strümpfe alles kartoffelsäcke? ihr denkt wohl ihr seid totale klugscheißer hää? seid ihr aba net denn ich bin eina und weiß was islam ist und net ihr ..ihr niiiiiiiiiippleeeeeeeeeeeeee ihr klenen scharmhaare !!! also leuddä föckt eüch wenn ihär wissän wöllt …weiß net wos..also islam is ya voll korreckt ey das isn teil meines lebäns genauso wie beim türkään der döner nää..ok dann ihr diggen ich bin voll derbe hacke also breit ihr scheßa bepisst euch ihr eichelmuschis…mfg der oba maka türke
After reading some of the response, i’d realise that:
1) It is intolerance that is cusing the current stir. Be it intolerance towards Muslim beliefs or intolerance towards western cultures.
2) Doesn’t mean that just becos when pple poke fun at christian or jewish beliefs, that makes it allowable to poke fun at islam.
3) Muslim doesn’t understand the west as much as the west doesn’t understand muslims.
4) Insults to ones religion vs violence to ones properties.
Question:
1) Why is it neccessary to provoke another person’s belief under the rationale of freedom of speech? Does freedom of speech justify provokation/insults?
2) When provoked, protesting shows the magnitude of expression, but is the burning of embassies, flags and calls for execution and other violence neccessary?
I think respect needs both understanding and tolerance be it to provoke or be provoked. It is apparent that the clash of cultures cannot be resolved overnight, but as we move on from this episode, we need to try to understand both sides of the issue and understand where it went out of hand, and how we can contribute positively to it rather than simply taking a biased stand.
This is our first strike against the infidels.
First, we will shame them into banning so-called freedom of speech on the grounds that it offends Allah. Their old standard for their so-called freedom of speech was that it was limited by “shouting fire in a theater”, or perhaps directly inciting people to violence. The new standard is that speech must not offend Allah’s followers, irrespective of their location. The result of this will be the much sought after death of so-called free speech in the West.
Then, we will shame them into banning all religious holidays, because they offend islamic migrants. The same will happen with secular holidays.
By this stage, they will be so utterly convinced that they are a group of mindless xenophobes who can never be right, that they will immediately give-in to all of our demands.
If they don’t submit, we shall threaten to bomb their cities. By this stage, their immigration policies will have created such a large number of jihadists in their midst that we can easily carry out our threat. They will be too afraid to assemble against us, for fear of being labelled ‘racist’. Divided, they will fall.
If any of them rise against us, we shall immediately accuse them of racism. As most of them have been brainwashed by the education systems of the 1970s, 80s and 90s, they will believe us, and start asking why they are so hateful.
Over time, our migrant enclaves can begin implementing Sharia law. Their police forces will not interfere, for fear of creating social unrest.
The decline of the West has come, my brothers. Soon, no infidel will dare insult the prophet anywhere on the globe. Our reach will be universal. A golden age will arise, in which all infidels will adopt the one true faith, or die.
I think it’s very degrading to Islam to even think of such a thing. One thing that Islam calls for is to respect the 2 other religions Judaism and Christianity. I dont mind the boycotting, what other way would the muslims get their revenge, after all it is a very sensitive topic. To degrade any prophet is a sin. But whats happening in Lebanon and Syria and other countries is monsterous. Unfortunately the media provide a false image about Islam. Indeed these people causing riots call themselves muslims. The words muslim and islam are derived from the word “salam” meaning peace. So I can say confidently that the people causing the riots are not true muslims and Allah will punish them.This is not a response t
When Iran mentioned that they are going to post picturs degrading the holocaust,I was devastated.I think it’s very degrading to Islam to even think of such a thing. One thing that Islam calls for is to respect the 2 other religions Judaism and Christianity. I dont mind the boycotting, what other way would the muslims get their revenge, after all it is a very sensitive topic. To degrade any prophet is a sin. But whats happening in Lebanon and Syria and other countries is monsterous. Unfortunately the media provide a false image about Islam. Indeed these people causing riots call themselves muslims. The words muslim and islam are derived from the word “salam” meaning peace. So I can say confidently that the people causing the riots are not true muslims and Allah will punish them.Racism is a sin.This is not a response to anyone but just a general point of view.
Thank you
Mustafa
somethings wrong with the posting process
Osama bin Laden,
Why don’t you implement Sharia on yourself, you family and Muslim’s country first before thinking of non-Muslim countries? Keeping in mind that you are talking about God’s Sharia, not your Sharia, prophet Bin Laden!
BTW, have you seen your niece butt? Or did you see the feminist images of prophet Mohammed all over The ISLAMIC Republic of Iran?
Get a life man. Really sick minded, brainwashed people like you are driving us to hell.
this is for Osama Bin laden . please osama i do understand your will to seek revenge from the western countries or all non-muslims,but i would appreciate it if you could express your anger in a more justified way. that would make it easier to maintain your self-respect and the respect for others. i`ve been giving my comments on this website almost everyday and i have been defending everything that seems to be misjudged, misunderstood or mistreated.
The first response that you will hear from the newspapaers is that thsi is freedom of speech. In Austria, and probebly in most of Europe, one can’t deny holocaust. Newspapaers, which published the cartoons second time knew perfactly well what they were doing. Since they chose to publish them any way. Now, they should face the consequences as well. If their countries embassies are burned or their companies are boycoted, well, keep in mind next time. Europeans still think like 50 years ago, when they were the dominanat power in the world, they still think that they can get away with lots of stuff. The reality is Europe is dying old continent which is losing its prominence with every passing day, they can’t do any thing else, except, may be coem up with childish stunts like these ones.
OBL,
you have mapped such a brilliant plan to enforce what you call as islamic law on the rest of the world,but it sounded more like your law.i think you need to get your head checked coz no one in their right minds would think up of such idiotic plans.when you bomb innocents the last thing that will come to mind is being worried about racism.it is not because of the majority of moslems,some of whome are my best buddies that islam is seen in such a bad light…it is because of people like you who dream up ludicrous plans and try to enforce it on the rest of us.get a life man,the world can do with more productive individuals.remember its very hard to create good,but only takes a few seconds to destroy it.peace.
What sort of plans are u talking about? Plz let me know.
my comment was for osama bin laden.please check his blog first
The problem with Europeans is that how quickly their population is dying, and how quickly they are losing influence in the world. Look at tiny belgium,a country with few million people colonized countries and area hundred time more than its size. 60 years agao, most countries in the world were like Europeans slaves, they could decide if Egypt could control its own Suez canal, they decided if Algerians had the right to independent country or not. They could move people from thousands of miles away, and put them in a place and tell them this is your country. What can Europeans do now, they can’t even tell Iran what to do. I think we should have behaved more maturly than we have done. Europeans absloutely don’t understand islamic psychology at all. For example, for one minute, did they ever think that why muslims or muslim countries didn’t say anything ever about JESUS? My question to all is why Muslims never say anything ever bad about Jesus, considering the fact that these cartoons have created such anger, that it would have been obvious that muslims should have published cartoons of Jesus in respomse. Why they didn’t do that. I think if europeans and Christian could only understand that, they would know why this has created such anger.
saw the cartoons on wb and am more puzzled to see on what or why are we reacting. if they are published with the caption of Jessus or Mussa, then there would not have been that strong reaction from muslims. I believe in that to let die a matter is to give a ignore to the extent that it vanishs within itself. See behind the lines, who is manipulating all these events. In Arabai, all most all muslims governments are divided on basic issues and jews are there to benefit. They are human beings and have to survive as this is their born right. You can’t vipe them out like Hitler tried.
Develop your own empire of resources and get rid of the ecnomic empire of the jewish lobby.use your brain and instead of fighting like old warriors, fight scientifically with the mind game. You can beat them when they play your game. Now with this reaction, muslims are playing their games and avoid all such incidnets of incitment or reactions to concur the minds, hearts.
haris
Perhaps because I’m not a self described ‘religious’ person, I see all of this hoopla as baffling. But I wonder how I might have reacted had I followed the Catholic upbringing of my childhood? Or if I’d been born in another century when Catholic meant something different, when it was a matter of survival?
How would I feel as a Muslim woman in a country where we all felt battered by an all-powerful nation?
Has anyone read “Reading Lolita in Tehran”?
Where Iranians were being bombed by Iraq with U.S. support?
Where the freedom of women to speak with another person who wasn’t a brother or other male relation was nil, where you couldn’t walk along the street with your hair uncovered because the street police might take you away? Where you couldn’t study something as innoccuous as literature by Nabokov because it was considered subversive and if you were caught doing it you would end up in jail?
I just don’t really get it. Of course it’s not right to make fun of another’s beliefs. Of course it’s not right to be a minority or an immigrant in a country that denies you the right to work or to otherwise have a decent life. Of course it’s not right for my imperialist country to wage war and kill innocent people (theirs as well as ours….not to mention all the maimed people who will never be the same…who will never live a normal life again.)
We all know this is not right. We all hate it. I suppose the question is now: What can we do about it?
Express our opinions? Is that enough?
Regarding all the hate and blah-blah-blah about each other’s religions, political views and personal opinions, I say: Give it a break. We’re all here on this planet for one reason. To live, love, and have children and for them to play together.
Get over your personal crap already. Hah.
Try this one on for size: get over it! Is there any logic in the actions of the protestors of the cartoons? No. Does buring the Danish flag truly accomplish anything? No. Is it fair to blame all of Denmark, let alone America and the West? No. Fine, express your opinion of distaste, however, why must it be violent? It is so pathetic and unoriginal. If you are so offended that you must turn to violence (i.e. turn into a copy cat of your peer who has far too much testosterone and self riteousness) then you are not a person of free thought, academic prowess, nor do you posess common sense. It sad really, and I pity you if this is who you are. You might as well live in a George Orwell novel. I wish you the best of luck in becoming your own person and hope that you some day you do.
wylie #205
with all my respect my dear, but i think the one overreacting and also contradicting herself is you. people like you are the ones causing the aggression all over the world. if u can not live with the fact that muslims are overreacting then at least do the opposite and do not overreact that would help and support the situation a little more. first u mention that u and ur country respect freedom of religion then yet again u say that u (quoting u again) “I and most westerners have absolutely NO RESPECT for your prophet”. i mean what kind of contradiction is this? at least try NOT TO include everyone on this website when u try judging or offending. be a little more specific about each and everyone of us! i would really appreciate it if you could discuss in a calm and mature way because this is JUST NON-SENSE and too unjustified.
WYLIE
No one asks you to believe in our prophet or to convert into Islam . All we expect from any civilized person on this planet is to show some respect towards his fellow men who are different.When You don’t respect my beliefs you don’t respect me and if you dont respect me I won’t respect you either.
leen #208
I fail to see how I contradicted my self. I stated that this country has freedom of speech, and I might add religion. I then stated that I have total respect for people to worship as they please and that in this country I would defend that right. Perhaps if I had used a word other than respect my point would have been better made. Let me try, ‘I, and most people in the west, attach no religous significance to the prophet. We will certainally not give him any better treatment than we give our own dieties’. If you disagree with that statement, please let me know the reason.
In this country it is not uncommon to see satire aimed to religion. While I find some distasteful(I am not an athiest) I still stand in its defense. So aboutariq #209 is asking that I give his ‘holy one’ treatment that I do not even give my own. That to me is a true contradiction. His(aboutariq)final statement may well encapsulate the entire conflict and I would suspect is a result of being raised in entirely different cultures. I could care less if he respects me or my GOD. And I am amazed he is concerned whether or not I respect him and his GOD. I can guanantee I will never threaten him with violence, not matter what he says. And I trust he can make the same commitment.
If I have offended with any of my comments I can say it was not intended. I am thrilled to find a place to interact, and perhaps debate, respectfully, with those different than me. I hope to learn something.
Wylie
you have been clear enough so far.Only one thing escapes you. i.e when you say you don’t respect my beliefs that may mean : 1)that you don’t care what they consist of ( and that’s your legitimate right which I totally respect)but would never be hostile to me as someone different. or 2)that you feel free to publically express hostile opinion about my beliefs ( which will offend me an make me react not boasting but defending myself against it.For me and for Moslems in general Religion is part of life.It is part of our identity.Islam is a religion of tolerance and mercy.We are not all extremists !
I support these cartoons and am tired of Muslims attempting to control my own freedoms of religion or speech. I am especially concerned about how Muslims (mainly those that follow strict Islamic laws) treat woman. Personally, this last points makes me feel that a great majority of Muslims are bigots and ignorant to the rights of others. When most Muslim women are given the “choice” to do X or Z, then I will be more open to listing to Muslims concerns about cartoons.
Aboutariq,
I do not think that all muslums are extremist. I think very few are. However, I am coming to believe there is a fundmental difference between the east and west, which I pray can be overcome. I fully understand your last statement but I just see things differently than you. I, like you, am not concerned with others beliefs, but I will loudly support their right to worship.
The difference between us is highlighted by your second statement. I would not take personal offense if you made hostile statements about my beliefs. I hear them all them time. Now, if you were attempting to limit my right to worship as I please(which you are not) then I would be forced to take actions. And have no doubts, religion is a major part of my life, and the life of many Americans. I am sad to say that is not so much the case in Europe, although I expect many Europeans would tell me to save my concern for someone else. It appears to me there are just 2 different levels of tolerance. I will only feel the need to take action if someone attempts to limit my rights. Many Muslums feel the need to take actions when someone makes a derogatory statement(or drawing) about their beliefs. The solution to this problem we hear from the east is to stop doing things that we take for granted in the west. So we are being asked to change our culture, or voluntarily surrender our rights, to not anger Muslums. Again, I hope our two cultures can come to a mutually satisfactory solution, but I fear that if one side or the other does not radically changs, we are in for a whole lot of strife.
Wylie,
I think difference and diversity are ingredients that give life a taste and the existence of different cultures is a good thing.All we need is to get to know each other more through communication and exchange.Everywhere in the world there is good and evil.And we need to put hand in hand to fight evil and praise good with disregard of religion or origin or colour. We are human beings an we may do wrong.
Majority of people on the blog seems to say that yes, there must be freedom of speech but… No one seems to understand that once you put a “but” in a statement, you have actually negated your statement about free speech. First of all, I do not understand how the Prophet got insulted by the cartoons? Does anyone know what he looked like? To me, all these cartoons are representing is the narrow-mindedness of Muslim extremists: suicide bombers, sectarian killers, destroyers, and roiters. Ain’t we Muslims committing these crimes every day? Didn’t we kill almost 3,000 innocent individuals (and that included Muslims too) in those plane crashes into Twin Towers in New York, and ain’t we responsible for killings all over Europe, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Palestine, Israel and Kashmir, just to name a few countries? This is what Islam is all about? And you preach that Islam is a peaceful religion.
Shame on us all, individually and collectively. We are trying to destroy the same societies that welcomed us, and took us into their houses, raised us and educated us. All these are asking that we should enjoy the freedom with voilence. Is it too much to ask? Is that the way we Muslims repay their hosts. Think about it.
Most of the people here demand that equal respect must first be made between the West and the Muslims with respect to Freedom of Speech. They say that the Muslims are hot-headed and intolerant of other cultures aside from their own. However, the question is, do majority of the Muslims really want to blow people up just for a bunch of cartoons? Surely they object to it, just as a devout Christian would be if Jesus/Christianity was insulted. But are they really so extremist in their religous beliefs?
A lot of muslims have expressed such hate and violence as evidence of their uproar in Europe, the Middle East and Asia. But these are only a small percentage of the whole Muslim population. Don’t help fan the flames of hate ignited by these radicals.
My point here is simple. Let’s not let the views of a small group of cartoonists be generalized as the views of an entire country or the West; at the same time, let’s not let a bunch of islamic extremists be generalized as the veiws of an entire religon. This entire issue was blown up only because people tend to generalize the views of a few radicals as the voice of the majority when it is not.
This goes to Muhammad khan 218…i wanna ask u smth…r u a moslem?? in case you are which i seriously doubt i will tell you what Islam truely is…first you say that u dont understand how the prophet (pbuh) got insulted by the cartoons and if anyone even knows how he looked like…well it is simply forbidden to even think about how he might has been lookin like…and if we (the moslems) are not allowed to picture him then other religion dont have the right to picture him AT ALL…we moslems never pictured jesus becaus we dont do such things as picturing holy people like our prophet mohammad (pbuh)or jesus..but the christians did.they draw jesus and in every church there is a total different face or body of jesus..we dont do that and we never did so please make sure of ur informations before you talk because your talkin nonsense…muslims are also not narrow-minded..the one who is narrow-minded is YOU and the rest of the people who do not understand what islam is…few of these extremists,suicide bombers etc you have mentiond might be moslems but dont you think that most of them are jews or even christians who are willing to do that just to show islam as a bad and violent religion? propaganda is what is saying that they are moslems but they are not this is only a way to show us as terrorists which is really sad how cheap the other religions became…we moslems respect other religions because we respect our own religion even more..we dont have any reason to attack anyone from another religion…and now another thing…u mentioned the plane crash in the twin towers in new york and that the terrorists were moslems…now if you read the past news from this date they say that in the plane there was not a single jew and if you ask me i think this is pretty weird so now dont you say that these were moslems because its obviously that the jews did clash the plane(s) in the twin towers so again dont discriminate the moslems…if you are a moslem,i feel ashamed that you belong to our religion because you definitly are not a moslem with this mentality…islam is not the religion you think,u simply dont have an idea of it so you’d better go and read the holy quran before you start talkin..and plus dont believe everythin you see in the tv or hear from other people…go by yourself and find out what is truely happening because again you ARE TALKIN TOTAL NONSENSE !!!
Hmm actually here’s what I think:
Well the danish guy said what he wanted. He did. Can we stop him ? No. He can say whatever he wants. HOWEVER, that’s great!
Now we have someone who needs to be enlightened. According to the drawings, he think our prophet is…undesirable. However that is untrue as a fact.
But we too have a right to say something. And we say you are wrong! In my opinion, it would be wise to remove the death threats and calm our soles to then find the source of this misunderstanding.
If they claim this to be freedom of speech than so can we. I say we simply speak our minds and indicate his faults. He insulted us but it might be because he has no idea or is ignorant about our prophet. If he did know however and simply is insulting him, THEN we can be angry. Of course, we cant legally physically harm him religious wise and legal wise, so I guess God will just see to it in the end.
We know the truths…
Let’s be realistic, Gin,After all,How can you deny the fact that Alqaida was responsible for the twin center attack while Usama Bin Laden himself claimed responsibility for it? Or do you think Even Alqaïda is fictitious or created by propaganda against Islam?
Those who drew the cartoons meant to represnt what they think is Prophet Sidna Muhammed.But for me it’s not him, so he is safe.This doesn’t deny the fact that they meant to distort his moral image and through it the image of islam and Muslims and they are to blame for that.
to SB 215
We,Muslims don’t try to control your freedom of speech or religion. We only try, like you, to defend ourselves and our religion and freedom of expression allows us, too,to do so.
Women are undirectly badly treated in the west too.They are most of the time considered as merely sex objects!
GOD not forgive you…Muslims believe on all Prophets. Dont make habit negative thinking. Please read this Ayat translation.
MARYAM (19)
“Mary”
(Revealed at Mecca, Verses 98)
In the name of Allah, The Merciful, The All-merciful
Kaf Ha Ya Ain Sad (K.H.Y.A.S.);(1)
the mention of thy Lord’s mercy to His servant Zachariah;(2)
when he called upon his Lord in low tones.(3)
He said, `my Lord, my bones are enfeebled, and my head is aflame with age, yet in calling on Thee, my Lord, I have never been unlucky.(4)
And I fear my kinsmen after I am gone, and my wife is barren, so grant me from Thee a heir,(5)
who shall inherit me and inherit the House of Jacob; and, my Lord, make him pleasing.’(6)
`O Zachariah, We give thee good news of a boy whose name shall be John. We have not made any worthy of his name before.’(7)
He said, `my Lord, how shall I have a son when my wife is barren, and I have reached extreme of old age.’(8)
He said, `so it will be; thy Lord says, `it is easy for Me, for I created thee before, when thou wast nothing’.(9)
He said, `my Lord, appoint for me a Sign?’ He said, `thy sign is that thou, though normal, shalt not speak to men for three nights.’(10)
So he came out to his people from the chamber, and made signal to them, `extol God at dawn and at night’.(11)
`O John, take the Book with strength’. And We gave him Judgement, while yet a child,(12)
and a tenderness and purity from us; and he was godfearing(13)
and kind to his parents, and he was not arrogant or defiant.(14)
And `peace be upon him, the day he was born, the day he dies, and the day he shall be raised to life.’(15)
And mention in the Book Mary, when she withdrew from her people to an eastern place,(16)
and she took a veil apart from them; then We sent to her Our Spirit and he appeared to her a normal man.(17)
She said, “I take refuge in the All-merciful from thee, if thou indeed art godfearing.’ (18)
He said, `I am but a messenger of thy Lord that I may bestow on thee a pure boy’.(19)
She said, `how shall I have a boy when no man has touched me, and I am not unchaste’.(20)
He said, `so it shall be; thy Lord says, `it is easy for Me and that We may make him a Sign for men and a mercy from Us, and it is a matter decreed.’(21)
So she conceived him and withdrew with him to a distant place.(22)
Then the birthpangs drove her to the trunk of the palm tree. She said, `would that I had died before this, and become a thing forgotten’.(23)
And one called her from below her, `do not grieve; thy Lord has set a rivulet below thee.(24)
And shake to thee the trunk of the palm tree, and it will drop on thee fresh ripe dates.(25)
So eat and drink and cool the eyes. And if thou seest any mortal, say, `I have vowed a fast to the All-merciful, so today, I shall not speak to any man.’(26)
Then, carrying him, she brought him to her people. They said, `Mary, thou hast surely committed a monstrous thing.(27)
O sister of Aaron, thy father was not a wicked man, and thy mother was not unchaste.’(28)
So she pointed to him. They said, `how shall we speak to one who is an infant in the cradle?’(29)
He spoke, `I am God’s servant; He has given me the Book and made me a Prophet,(30)
and He has made me blessed wherever I may be, and He has enjoined on me the Prayer and the Alms-giving as long as I live,(31)
and to be kind to my mother; and He has not made me arrogant and unlucky.(32)
And peace be upon me, the day I was born, the day I die and the day I shall be raised alive.’(33)
That is Jesus, son of Mary, in word of truth in which they doubt.(34)
It is not for God that He should take to Him a son __ He is Holy. When He decrees a thing, He only says to it, `be’, and it is.(35)
And (he said) `God is my Lord and your Lord, so serve Him __ this is a straight path.’(36)
But the sects have differed among them; so woe to those who disbelieve for the witnessing of a Mighty Day.(37)
How well they will hear and see on the day they come to Us! But, today the wrong-doers are clearly astray.(38)
And warn them of the Day of Regret, when the matter shall be decided; but they are heedless and they do not believe.(39)
We ourselves shall inherit the earth and all those that are upon it, and to Us they shall be returned.(40)
And mention in the Book Abraham; he was surely a truthful man, a Prophet.(41)
When he said to his father, `father, why dost thou serve that which neither hears nor sees, nor avails thee anything.(42)
Father, there has come to me such knowledge as has not come to thee, so follow me and I shall guide thee to an even path.(43)
Father, do not serve the Devil; the Devil is surely a rebel to the All-merciful.(44)
Father, I fear that a punishment from the All-merciful shall afflict thee so that thou shalt become a comrade of the Devil.’(45)
He said, `art thou averse to my gods, Abraham? If thou dost not give over, I will stone thee; so leave me for some time.’(46)
He said, `peace be upon thee! I shall pray my Lord for thy forgiveness; He is surely gracious to me.(47)
And I go apart from you and what you call upon, apart from God, and I will call upon my Lord; perhaps I shall not be unlucky in calling upon my Lord.’(48)
So when he went apart from them and what they were serving, apart from God, We bestowed upon him Isaac and Jacob; and each We made a Prophet.(49)
And We bestowed upon them Our mercy, and We made for them a renowned tongue of truth.(50)
And mention in the Book Moses; he was specially chosen, and he was a Messenger, a Prophet.(51)
And We called to him from the right side of the Mount, and We drew him near in communion.(52)
And, out of Our mercy, We bestowed on him his brother Aaron, a Prophet.(53)
And mention in the Book Ishmael; he was true to his promises, and he was a Messenger, a Prophet.(54)
And he used to bid his people the Prayer and the Alms-giving, and he was pleasing to his Lord.(55)
And mention in the book Idris; he was a true man, a Prophet;(56)
and We raised him up to a high place.(57)
Those are the ones whom God blessed, among the Prophets of the off-spring of Adam, and of those We bore with Noah, and of the offspring of Abraham and Israel, and of those We guided and chose. When the signs of the All-merciful were recited to them they fell down prostrate, weeping.(58)
Then there succeeded after them successions that wasted the Prayer and followed lusts; they shall soon meet perversion,(59)
except those who repent and believe and do righteous deeds; they shall enter Paradise and shall not be wronged in the least;(60)
Gardens of Eternity that the All-merciful has promised His servants in the unseen; His promise is surely fulfilled.(61)
They will not hear any non-sense there, but only greetings of peace; and they shall have their provision there at dawn and evening.(62)
That is Paradise which We shall give in inheritance to such of Our servants who are godfearing.(63)
And we do not come down but at the command of thy Lord; to Him belongs what is before us, what is behind us and what is between that; and thy Lord is never forgetful;(64)
Lord of the heavens and the earth and what is between them, so serve Him, and be steadfast in His service; dost thou know anyone worthy of His Name?(65)
And Man says, `when I am dead, shall I be brought forth alive?’(66)
But does man not remember that We created him before, when he was nothing?(67)
So, by thy Lord, We will surely muster them and the devils, then We shall bring them about the Hell on their knees;(68)
then We shall draw forth from every party such of them as were most hardened in disdain of the All-merciful.(69)
Then, We surely know very well those most deserving to burn in it.(70)
And there is none among you, but he shall arrive at it; that is definite and decreed with thy Lord.(71)
Then, We shall deliver those who fear God, and leave the wrongdoers there on their knees.(72)
And when Our clear signs are recited to them, the unbelievers say to the Believers, `which of the two parties is better in position and fairer in company?’(73)
But how many a generation have We destroyed before them, who were better in gear and outward show?(74)
Say, `whoso is astray, let the All-merciful prolong his term long; till when they see what they are threatened with, whether the punishment or the Hour, they will know who is worse in position and weaker in hosts.’(75)
And those who are guided, God increases them in guidance; and the abiding things, the deeds of righteousness, are better in reward with thy Lord and better in return.(76)
And hast thou seen him who disbelieves in Our signs and says, `I shall surely be given wealth and children?’(77)
Has he observed the unseen or taken a covenant with the All-merciful?(78)
No indeed! We shall write down what he says, and We shall prolong for him the punishment,(79)
and We shall inherit from him what he says, and he shall come to Us alone.(80)
And they have taken to them gods, apart from God, that they might be for them a might(81)
No indeed! they will deny their service, and shall be pitted against them.(82)
Hast thou not seen how We have sent the devils over the unbelievers to incite them?(83)
So be not in haste against them; We are only numbering them.(84)
On the day that We muster the godfearing to the All-merciful as guests, (85)
and drive the sinners to Hell in a herd;(86)
they will not have any power of intercession, except him who has made a covenant with the All-merciful.(87)
And they say, `the All-merciful has taken to Himself a son.’(88)
You have indeed advanced a hideous thing!(89)
The heavens may be rent of it, and the earth split asunder, and the mountains fall down crashing,(90)
for that they have attributed to the All-merciful a son.(91)
It behoves not the All-merciful that He should take a son.(92)
None is there in the heavens and the earth but he comes to the All-merciful as a servant.(93)
He has counted them and He has numbered them exactly;(94)
and, on the Day of Resurrection, everyone of them shall come to Him all alone.(95)
Those who believe and do righteous deeds, the All-merciful shall assign to them love.(96)
So We have made it easy by thy tongue, that, thereby thou mayest give good news to the godfearing, and warn a stubborn people.(97)
And how many a generation We have destroyed before them! Dost thou perceive anyone of them, or hear of them a wispier?(98)
# 223 RG–> i totally agree with you. whoever mentioned the fact that women are being mistreated in the arab world or islamic world is in my point of view totally unreasonable and uneducated or better say : VAGUE!!! it happens in countries all over the world. not only are women being mistreated, but also children and men too. if you could read a little more or watch many documentaries you’d know what i am talking about or what RG is talking about.
as for #222 TAMIM, i have to correct you and say that GIN did NOT DENY THE FACT that muslims were involved in the twin tower attack, she just involved the subject of the jews as well. she did not put them out of the question saying they did not have a hand in it, cuz it was mentined above a dozen times that jews did have a role in that attack. however, who exactly planned it all still remains a puzzle and i`m not quite sure if its right that osama bin laden admitted to have committed that. i remember them mentioning on tv that when he was questioned whether has a something to do with it or not all he answered was : (smile) i wish i was the one who has done that!!!