Cartoons, more devastating!
Written by Haitham Sabbah on 24. February 2006, 2335hrs // Part of Haitham Sabbah's adventure in Arab, Bleeding Edge, Failures, Iraq, Islam, Middle East, Religion, War // Other posts by Haitham Sabbah
Protest… Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Libya, Sudan, Pakistan, Iran, just name it…. everywhere Muslims filled the streets defying their government, and decrying the evil in the West. They call it Denmark, or the American Satan, or whatever. The reason? The infamous Danish cartoon.
Was that the greatest affront to Islam in recent decades? What about the more direct attack on Islam and Muslims? How about the bombing of a 1200 year old mosque? Yes, the bombing of the Shia Shrine in Samarra. How about the slaughter of hundreds of Muslims? How about burning and destroying dozens of Sunni mosques in Iraq as retaliation? Why is this not more offensive of these stupid cartoons? Isn’t Islam the Religion of Peace? Where are the street riots?
It was quite in Muslim world… It is hot and bloody in Iraq!
Violence is the time-honored way of solving any dispute, political or not. Diplomacy is not respected. It’s a sign of weakness. This is how it looks now. Isn’t this a far greater sin for Muslims to kill each other and burn mosques and Koran than a disrespectful picture of the Prophet?
This isn’t going to get better. More and more it seems we’re dealing not with a small minority of kooks, but an epidemic of extremism that is bloodthirsty and violent at its core. Call it Sunni, call it Shi’a, call it Wahhabi’s, call it Batheist, call it whatever, I don’t care. It’s all revolving around the nation of Islam and Muslims.
Worse than the colorful infamous cartoons are the ‘human flesh cartoons’. The cartoons that are rioting our streets blindly. The human flesh cartoons that are killing Muslims, bombing and burning mosques. The cartoons which is blaming it on occupation and Israel. Did Israel send troops to burn our mosques? Did the American Satan send troops to kill our Imams and burn our Qur’an?
Shame on you Muslims. Shame that you protest over the Dane cartoons yet shut-up on the Human/Muslim flesh cartoons.
Not that I’m not asking Muslim to go out in protests around the Islamic world. But wondering why Muslims in Iraq are not Muslims enough? Why can they protest against a cartoon, yet do not respect their brother Iraqi Muslims? A tomb build of stones, covered with golden flakes is more important than hundred of slaughtered Muslim, by Muslims all in the name of ISLAM!
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March 2nd, 2006 at 7:19 am
Concerned,
My only point is using the Native American analogy was to point out that conquest has played a major role in shaping many civilizations besides Islam. I guess I misinterprted your post to assume you were one of the Islam-bashers who’ve been trolling this blog the past couple of the weeks. Having reread your posts, I realize that is not the case, although I disagree with most of your arguments. In any case, you are correct that it is not relevant to this debate.
And I should say that having spent some time on the Blackfoot reservation in Montana, I found most Native Americans to be very patriotic.
March 2nd, 2006 at 7:25 am
By the way, this article by Paul Schroeder in The American Conservative basically sums my own thinking on how to approach Al Qaeda:
http://www.amconmag.com/2004_10_25/feature.html
I’d also recommend the group Coalition for a Realistic Foreign Policy:
http://www.realisticforeignpolicy.org/
March 2nd, 2006 at 11:25 am
Joe.
Cancel above with apologies. Somehow I read your post to say your fiance is Moslem rather than your fiance is Arab which is what you said. Needless to say I still disagree with your description of Islam. The last time I checked, it’s ok to disagree with someone, but in this case somehow I misread you completely. Very sorry, I’m tired, under stress, but no excuse for my mistake. I wish that somehow we could get back to a constructive discussion and my own post last to you did not add anything to that purpose. I promise to try harder in the future.
March 2nd, 2006 at 8:05 pm
Robin,
My apologies to you. That was unfair to say such a thing and interject myself into a conversation that I had nothing to do with. Again…my apologies.
March 2nd, 2006 at 8:18 pm
Michelle,
Thank you, and my apologies to you for any disagreements we’ve had in the past, sincerely.
As I drove my children to school this morning, it was you I had in mind, honestly. I have not meant to offend you, my goal has rather been to share my experience as a testimony in the moderation I seek for all the world.
I am NOT naive to Islamic terrorism Michelle, I’ve seen too damn much of it up close and personally. They are absolutely the most frightening people on the face of this earth. I have just tried to tell you, and others, that this is not the Islam I know or the Islam that I have seen so many people practicing. I urge you, and others, to recognize the fact that this blog is the domain of a Palestinian Jordanian with his own view of things. His is HIS reality and it exists no less or no more than the other views on this planet. I urge you all to contact him somehow, even if you use his email at haitham.sabbah@gmail.com. Ask him questions, open dialog and be open to listening. He wants to build bridges for his children’s sake, as do I and many others. When you get down to basics, I think everyone should be willing to listen to those who want to reach out. This is a crazy world, but at the end of the day we’re all here on this earth to share it. Just like in your personal relations, listen to why the other person is mad. Then you can decide for yourselves if you never want to speak again.
Thank you Michelle again and Peace (Ma’Salama, Arabic for Go with God)
March 2nd, 2006 at 8:33 pm
Michelle,
One more note: I was thinking about you BEFORE I saw your post. You got to me and just wanted to share that with you.
March 2nd, 2006 at 8:39 pm
Michelle,
OK that was another one of my bungled posts. What I meant was that I wanted to reach out to you again BEFORE I saw your post. Hope I got my thoughts right this time. (maybe early Alzheimers but hopefully not)
March 2nd, 2006 at 8:43 pm
Robin,
You have no idea how torn I am when it comes to the Islamic religion. In my heart I know that Islam is not evil and that the majority who practice it, practice it with goodness and kindness in mind. But, (and there’s always a but) we are dealing with a minority that distorts this religion by killing, destroying, and intimidating those who don’t follow in their beliefs. It’s very difficult to ignore this minority when they are responsible for over 90% of terrorism today.
With all of that said, I am willing to try and look beyond the ugliness that the minority has brought to this religion and try to remember that not all Muslims behave or believe in this manner. I will try to listen more rather than talk more and I promise to keep myself open to all possibilities. It’s the least I can do as a Christian.
March 2nd, 2006 at 9:18 pm
Michelle,
I have the same ambivalence regarding the Muslim faith and the few that distort it. However, it is kind of hard to ignore the few that soil it in the name of their God. The terroristic acts anger many and they, therefore, overlook the majority that are righteous. It is incumbent upon moderate Muslims, if there are any out there, to squash this growing cancer called radical Muslims. Radical muslims or extremists want to take us back to a time when women were at their mercy and civil rights were no existent. Perhaps it is still, to some extent, true. All people deserve to be free to choose ones own way and not be forced to swallow the dictates of the few. This is a Muslim issue and Muslims need to take care of it in their own way. Stamp out the radicals. Allow them to voice their views but be quick to step in when they pillage and destroy.
March 2nd, 2006 at 9:40 pm
Michelle and Robert,
Please, please remain open, even if it’s for a moment. Ask questions of moderate Moslems such as Haitham. If there is any opportunity for you to visit an Arabic restaurant, go and taste the food. Talk to the waiter if they are Moslem, strike up a conversation. If you see a woman who is wearing Islamic dress, say hello to her. (Be warned she might not understand you or maybe be frightened herself). Look up sights on the web that are informative about Islam from an objective viewpoint. Wherever you can, seek some more knowledge. They ARE out there, they ARE the majority (or at least I hope I don’t have my head in the sand) and they are the absolute most hospitable people I have ever met.
Michelle, take your Christianity to heart (as I do) and witness your own kindness to Moslems who are afraid of their own boogey-men. Kimmy over on another site offered some really good advise, he said he went hiking among wild animals in the forest and just listened. Now the analogy isn’t exactly perfect, but he says he ended up very close to many of them. No, I am not suggesting you befriend a crazy Moslem, I am just saying there is a very strong chance that the kind and gentle one you encounter is more afraid of you then you should ever be of them. Always be kind, and always listen. Run for the hills if you are threatened and NEVER accept violence. Just be open to a voice out there that wants to meet you half way.
Peace!
March 2nd, 2006 at 10:50 pm
Robin,
Very well said. You speak the language of peace and tolerance. I like that. In that aspect you are an enlightened being. Nice knowing you. Keep it up.
March 2nd, 2006 at 10:54 pm
P.S. to above note, I met my ex-husband on a blind date, that is also an opportunity that just might crop up. Honest to God, on my children’s lives, it’s true.
March 2nd, 2006 at 11:44 pm
Robin,
Beautifully said! I am wondering though what it was like to live in Saudi Arabia. Especially as a woman. I ask not to point fingers or make accusations….just pure curiosity.
March 3rd, 2006 at 5:53 pm
Hi Robin,
I just finished reading an article about Muslims targeting the 12 year old daughter of one of the cartoonist who drew the Mohammad image. As infuriating as that is, what’s really concerning me more is why haven’t these Muslims been arrested. I also watched a video of Muslims protesting in the UK over these cartoons and some of the men were threatening to invade Denmark and rape their women. As awful and as frustrating as that is for me to see and hear, I’m still not going to allow it to paint all Muslims as bad. I still want to learn more about the faith and keep and open mind to bridging this gap that we seem to have between the Islamic world and the Western world.
We live in dangerous times I guess and I just hope that things start to cool down before something really awful happens.
March 4th, 2006 at 7:52 pm
Tamim,
I’m an American who was married to a Moslem as you can tell from my posts. You stated your position beautifully. I GET it (what you are saying), but it’s so hard in the West for people to understand. You’re all a bunch of terrorists or terrorist enablers as far as they’re concerned. Could you talk more to make your point even clearer. Shukran Kathir
March 4th, 2006 at 10:13 pm
Thanks Robin,
You have been aquainted quite closely with Moslems and Arabs and it’s clear you know them well enough to agree with me.However, I’m from a more open country than Saudi Arabia and We are even more moderate.Radical islamist movements didn’t exist before 1980.Even nowadays despite the trouble they made a few years ago,they have never been popular or influential because in the whole country,people have always had moderate Islamic traditions.Quite a lot of foreign people from different western countries visit the country as tourists and are astonished by the hospitality of the people.Many western people buy houses and choose to stay.
March 4th, 2006 at 11:06 pm
Tamim,
My ex-inlaws were a VERY moderate, westernized family and were not radical AT ALL. It’s kind of hard to explain without giving details, but I assure you it’s true. In my paricular case, I received the very same hospitality you refer to and could not agree more. I have Arab friends from just about every country in the Mideast and my ex lives in Bahrain with his new wife so he could escape the problems all around him. Although it WAS Saudi Arabia, I think we’re more on the same page than you might think. Without giving details, cause I know ANYONE could read this, what country do you hail from? I think your statement about radical movements not existing before 1980 is pretty much on the mark except that they WERE there in the Islamic Brotherhood except they became even more apparent after the Iranian Revolution. I personally saw a major shift towards a more fundamentalist view even in Saudi when my sister-in-laws started wearing the veil when they had never done so before. It wasn’t because they wanted to, it’s just the mutawa forced the issue and had gained power from their buddies next door in Iran
March 5th, 2006 at 2:32 am
Robin,
There is no contradiction between being Moslem and believing in human rights and democracy. Values from Islam are to complete democratic values. Extremism comes from political movements that use Islam as an Ideology rather than simply a religion. They believe in the Islamic State in which Islamic law is applied. One doesn’t have to be dressed in a gown and to have a beard or a scarf and veil to be a good Moslem. As far as I’m concerned and like the majority of my countrymen a good Moslem is the one who of course does his essential duty towards God (praying etc.) and who behaves righteously in society treating others well, doing good and “wishing his fellow men what he wishes for himself”. We have learnt to act as Moslems rather than just appear as Moslems. I’m from Morocco where radical Islamists were not in view until 1980.
March 5th, 2006 at 3:08 am
Tamin,
Thanks for getting back to me. I know that your view is EXACTLY the same as my ex and his family. As for their dress, they only dress that way in Saudi, anywhere else, even Lebanon when they go, they dress western and just fit in. It has gotten so much worse for them there since fundamentalism has become so radical His new wife is Austrian and the reason they left was because of what their daughters were being taught in school, even a so-called moderate private one. I absolutely know the beauty of Islam as it is supposed to be practiced. I learned so much from being with Moslems from their charity to their family values. It bothers me to the bottom of my soul that your religion is so maligned by ignorant people. If only Christians and Moslems could come together and realize that they are so similar, maybe the few differences wouldn’t be such a problem. Just a note, I’ve always wanted to go to Morocco since my parents went and loved it. Thanks again for getting back to me.
March 5th, 2006 at 4:21 am
“Only God judges people.”
Indeed he does. I’m not innocent by any stretch of the imagination and I did hold biased views on all Muslims…but Robin has helped me to see the error of my ways. It’s a difficult process but I’m trying very hard to let go of my biased views and see people for whom they are and not what I percieve them to be.
Hi Robin, I’ve been busy and haven’t had a chance to get back to you. How are you doing?
March 5th, 2006 at 9:49 am
Hi Michelle,
I’m fine thanks. I hope to goodness I did not offend you when I said “Christian could mean just about anything”. I posted another bungle when I said THAT one. It’s just I know I’m a liberal Catholic, then there are evangelicals and moderates and numerous others. Some Christians that I have spoken with would not give a Moslem the time of day and others are OK with it. I only was trying to give you the thumbs up because I know how hard it is. Believe me, I have a hard time with some religions and their beliefs and it was ME who didn’t want to give them the time of day. Hope you understand what I meant.
I gave you my email up there if you want it so the more off topic portion of our conversation could be held away from here.
March 10th, 2006 at 10:56 am
Michele;
I live in Canada and we get fox new on our cable networks.
I would never ever describe FOX news as balanced; it is more like Fox News the BUSH network. Not that CNN is any better.
Concerned;
I agree with much of what you say, although you have to consider that military conquest is not the only type of coquets, The US is famous when it comes to meddling in the politics of other countries (south America, middle east, Africa……), it also uses it’s economical might to effect the politics, of other nations.
The Idea that America is all for spreading democracy and freedom for all is up surd, how can you claim to fight for freedom and equality while aligning yourself with dictators and oppressors who abuse human rights openly. (Pakistan, China, Saudi Arabia….and so on). Attacking Afghanistan was justified but attacking Iraq was about greed and self interest, not to mention illegal.
Let’s call a spade a spade.
The US like any other nation, looks out for it’s own interests, lets not make it a “saint”
Of a nation. Having said this I would rather be ruled by the laws of the US than by the rules of a dictator and extremist nation.
March 11th, 2006 at 5:50 am
Moughly,
That is right, the US is no saint. I agree 100%. Your last sentence sums it all up. Be careful, you might get a backlash from the likes of Robin or Tomas. They don’t like it if you say nice things about the US. “I would rather be ruled by the laws of the US than by the rules of a dictator and extemist nation.” That about sums it up doesn’t it.
March 11th, 2006 at 8:45 am
Robert
I believe in giving credit where credit is due.
Although I can understand why there is so much resentment towards the US, just look at how powerful the US corporations are, in India Mont Santos has made it Illegal for a farmer to save his own seeds, US corporations have no issue with using child labor as long as it is done in another country, and when you watch the TV shows and movies the vast majority glorifies violence and highly sexualized, even the main stream music that it promoted, like the modern HIP HOP…adding to all this the irrational acts of the current administration and what you get?
Yes I would prefer to live under the US laws and constitutional rights. But Americans must stand up and fight to make these laws and rights applicable to all including the prisoners in Guantanamo Bay, Iraq India ad so on, there must not be anyone above these laws including the corporations and government, otherwise America will be no better than the rest.
Thank you
March 11th, 2006 at 5:20 pm
Mougly,
You make some excellent points. There is a lot of hypocrisy in the US method. We don’t want our children working in sweatshops for less than minimum wage yet we do business with companies that take advanatage of children overseas. The US is guilty of such involvement but I think the government position is that we do not control what happens over there. If other cultures allow it then they should fix it not us. We are accused of too much involvement and infringement on other countires. The other point you made was how sexualized our culture is and the “sex sells” mentality. That is the result of the freedoms we have. Would you prefer the government to tell us what we can and cannot put on television? It is up to parents to make sure that undesireable content is not viewed by children. The government does not control hip hop messages that glorify violence. The first amendment provides freedom of speech. If people don’t like it they can turn the channel or not purchase such music. That is a democracy.
March 12th, 2006 at 6:57 am
Robert I agree with you 100%, I do not believe it is the governments responsibility to control what people are allowed to see and how people should express themselves, I was just making the point that when someone is looking at how our society conducts it’s business it appears that all westerners care about, is material gain and outward appearances, and are willing to do anything to get it.
This is in part is why many in the Muslim world view the west in such a bad light.
We as people need to change how we respond to the media and start to educate our children that appearances and material gains are not what is the most important, but what is, is how we deal with one another and that inner beauty and substance is what is really important. Let’s promote family values and community living.
March 12th, 2006 at 6:24 pm
Mougly,
Very well said. We are on the same page here. I totally agree that the west appears to be very materialistic because it is. It is a capitalistic society that allows for the free flow of enterprise. Whoever works hard can improve their lifestyle. What is wrong with that? By the way, the west also has its views. We view the Muslim world as fanatical and religously driven. We see Muslims as manipulated by a few clerics and incited at their whim. We also see the Muslim world as underdeveloped and poor. The west typically does not respect that because it is capitalistic and rich. Here in the US you are judged by what you wear, car you drive, job you have and house you live in. The American dream has to do with having things and wealth. We are totally different cultures. One is not better than the other but different.
March 12th, 2006 at 6:32 pm
Mougly,
One more thing. If Muslims have such a negative view of the west then why are so many Muslims relocating to European countries and the US? Why do so many Muslim households pirate western television programming? The world is very Americanized and muslim extemists hate that. Our western businesses are bombed often because there is resentment. Our businesses could not thrive over there unless Muslims were frequenting those places. Our culture is free and most people ultimately believe that they and not some government should have the freedom the choose for themselves what their destiny will be. American also see Muslims as terrorist and savages to some extent. We do not understand the concept of strapping bombs on oneself and killing others. We see Muslims protesting on the streets burning flags and ranting with rabid fervor. All of the 911 murderers were either Arab or of Muslim descent. We are holding a grudge against Muslims because of it. Now, I know Muslims are misunderstood and that only extremists engage in such bad conduct. I am only pointing out the western perspective.
March 12th, 2006 at 8:42 pm
Mougley,
Yes there is no where in the world I would rather live (as long as I get to travel and see the US from a different perspective) than the United States. You made some very good points when you said,”Let’ promote family values and community living”. I agree with you 100% on that one. If our media was only more responsible in taking the lead then no one would even suggest censorship. I am NOT for censhorship at all. I am a firm believer in our first amendment’s right to free speech, but it is up to each and every entity to foster the very values you suggestd.
Since the topic here is the cartoon debacle, let me stray just a little bit. I believe that our media’s promotion of violence is connected, as proven by many academic studies, to the violence on the streets of America. Just a few years ago in Los Angeles a caucasion family strayed into a gang area by making the wrong turn and the entire family was slaughtered. We talk about the cartoon riots with such disdain, when here in the US entire neighborhoods are unsafe to live. I think it is a bit of hypocracy on our part to point the finger at the Moslem mobs and blame Islam as the cause. No I am absolutely not condoning their actions. I am simply pointing out the fact that here in the US our own citizens are endangered by the violence on our own streets but yet we point a finger elsewhere.
March 12th, 2006 at 9:04 pm
It is unsafe anywhere you go no matter what country. There are always elements of deceit and evil. The US is getting pummeled on these correspondences. Where is the balance?
March 12th, 2006 at 9:20 pm
If anyone would like to research my analogy, please do so by researching gang violence in the US. Is not a gang the same as a mob which acts selectively when serving their own needs and territory? We have also had our fair share of riots here in the US pariculary in Los Angeles during the Watts riots of the 60’s and the recent Rodney King riots. Perhaps those looking at the US from abroad would infer from watching this that it has something to do with our society. Are we not a self proclaimed Judeo-Christian nation? Are we not the greatest nation on earth at this PARTICULAR moment in history? Why is it if we are the greatest nation on earth we are not adressing our own violence at home in a more competant manner?
March 13th, 2006 at 4:43 am
Not even the greatest nation on earth can solve all of its problems. Being great does not infer perfection. That was a leap. While the US has its dangerous neighborhoods it also has the rule of law and evil doers most often are caught and incarcerated.
March 14th, 2006 at 4:39 am
Robert
Regarding your question “If Muslims have such a negative view of the west then why are so many Muslims relocating to European countries and the US?” I ask my self that question often, especially when I here and see the extremists who preaching hate messages against everything to do with the western society, and yet choose to immigrate to western countries. I am not sure why they come.
As for your comments regarding how the west views Muslims, again I agree with you, although that is unfortunate but again this it due in large part to what we see on our TV sets, and also in part due to the fact that the extremists always make the most noise, see the media plays a huge part in shaping peoples thoughts, that is why we have to push for a balanced media coverage, push to stop the promotion of violence in any form, and take responsibility to educate our children that there are alternative ways to deal with conflict. Maybe then we can lead by example instead of pointing out each others faults, as we all have our issues. In the Islamic world they have the extremist elements, in the west we have the money and power hungry greedy side to deal with.
March 14th, 2006 at 4:46 am
Mougly,
Yes, I totally agree with you that the media has a lot to do with shaping people’s views of the Islamic world. Indeed the extremists make the most noise and as they say, “the squeaky wheel gets the grease.” We need to hold the media more accountable for lobsided reporting.