To really understand the source of the problem, just look at which side produces the most casualties.

your contention that the Arab-Israeli wars were all the result of “unprovoked” Arab attacks on the state of Israel is patent nonsense. First of all, the 1967 war was initiated by Israel, and not the Arabs. Israel proclaimed their attack was a preemptive strike against those nations that constituted an existential threat to the state Israel; they had to strike first in order to preserve their existence. This justification for war was merely a pretext. Israel’s swift victory over her enemies confirms this. Any nation or nations whose military you can vanquish within 6 days does not pose an existential threat your nation.

The 1967 war had more to do with fulfilling the dreams of those who believed in a “greater Israel,” which had to include the heart of the ancient kingdom that was located in Judea and Samaria, than anything else, even though there were obvious strategic benefits as a result of this action. Yet it is clear, the benefits gained as a result of this action did not include survival of the state of Israel. And, ironically, many of these strategic benefits would become strategic detriments.

The 1973 war was clearly initiated by the Egyptian Arabs. However, the aggression was hardly “unprovoked.” The provocation was the territorial gains, which included Egyptian land, made by Israel in the preceding war. Prior to the war, however, Sadat extended the olive branch to the Israeli’s; he offered an exchange of land for peace. The Israeli’s refused his offer, which resulted in Egypt attacking Israel. Ironically, Israel eventually would accept his offer at camp David.

The 1948 war can also hardly be seen as “unprovoked.” Well if you believe the systematic ethic cleansing of the Palestinians from their homeland was not a provocative action, I suppose you could interpret the Arab attack as unprovoked.

On a side note, I must say I find certain parallels amid America’s wars of conquest in the 19th century, i.e. the Indian and Mexican wars, and that of Israel’s wars of conquest. These parallels are particularly relevant because of America’s and Israel’s “special relationship.” As far as I can see, the Zionists and the Americans were motivated by a similar type of romanticism and idealism. This provided part of justification of their wars of conquest – a threat some kind was needed to fully justify the war. The Americans believed, like the Zionists, that they had a “manifest destiny” to capture, pacify and settle the West, even though it was then currently inhabited by the indigenous peoples of the Americas, and, also, owned by Mexico.

Both nations needed a pretext. In the case of Israel it was the survival of the state, and protection from the bloodthirsty Arab rabble; and in the case of the United States, it was the fact that Mexican troops had spilt American blood (forgetting that the American army was ordered to set up camp in Mexican territory in order to provoke the Mexicans). And the result of all this was: the Americans conquering half of Mexico( known today as the American West) and the Zionist conquering Palestine, and then the West Bank and the Sinai.

ultimately the palestinians lost their land in the war of 1967, generally if you lose a war everyone is killed or they live treated as 2nd class citizens. you’ll notice the Palestinians have a greater backing for a country than any other oppressed groups(ex the kurds have no kurdistan). Ironically the Arab world should be ashamed of the way they help the palestinians with Weapons and with nothing more. From what I’ve read the palestinians are not treated so great in jordan,egypt or lebanon… the only answer is a free independant palestine, made up of the land they have today without any settlements (as a basic starting point, with time and peace I’m sure there can be deals made). In short if you lose the war you have to restart your bid for independance without getting you want for the initial time.

If someone lose a war, everyone is NOT killed or treated as 2nd class citizen. Take for example Germany and Japan… without going too far from the main point here: losing a war is something and occupation is something else. What Israel is doing is not winning a war, but occupying a land that does not belong to them and winning a war does not give legality to occupation, unless Israel is something different than all known laws!

I agree, the only solution is a free independent Palestine, but not the one that is proposed today. If there is going to be a lasting peace, it has to be one country, call it Palestine, Israel or even Isralestine. The reason is simple, refugees will not accept any midway solution, no matter what is offered other than returning their land.

my god your god his god a god. you’re all people, you all like ice cream and pizza. your god was wrong.this is how the whole mess started. the truth is its everyones land, the romans have as much stake as the palestinians do, they there for a 100 years?.there have been many groups of people living there, and it will only survive in peace.

I can’t agree more. When I say “Your God”, I’m being sarcastic of the religious claims of some, whereas others, like Christians and Muslims have same claims. At the end, I believe in one thing. “Land for all, and religion for God.” Other than that is nothing more than stirring the dirty water.

Now I do believe Israel reacts with a strong hand on alot of issues but how do you fight a terrorist group that lives and hides amoung the innocent? its not possible. And who suffers, innocent palestinians who want a normal life. If it was a non violent (Ghandi) struggle you would be eating pizza in jeruselem right now.

Here comes the wrong misleading statements. Let me ask you one simple question. When someone comes and occupy your home and you react back with resistance and fighting back. What is the occupier called if he kills your family, and what are you called if you kill his (which he brought to sleep in your bed)?

The answer is simple. Occupation is terrorism. Fighting back is called “RESISTANCE”. Yes, resistance, resistance, resistance, keep repeating it back until you unlearn what the Zionist media keeps on repeating until it became facts for ignorant. That’s what they call as, “keep repeating a lie until it becomes the fact.”

Now, as we agreed, Palestinian militia is called, resistance, and these resistance, unlike criminals like Bin Laden; did not run out of their country. They are living in their homes land, between their families, and they have all the right to defend themselves and their families with all means, ALL MEANS. When was resistance a crime but in Palestine? Ironic.

Second, let’s look at it this way. A criminal comes and kill one of your sons and occupy your home, you ask for help, no one give it, you act by your own, the criminal kills one more of your sons again, you decide to revenge and kill one of his sons, he comes and kill ten of yours, you go back and kill 2, he comes and kill 20, and so on. Now, you are living in a tent which you build in the back garden of your home, and the criminal is living inside your home with all his family. So, the question is, who is taking civilians as human shield? The criminal which occupied your home and brought his family in, or you and the remaining of your family which lives in the tent and have no place else to run to when the criminal decide to kill your family while you are a sleep?

who’s history books are we talking about? every country has a diffenent on, I believe there is no israel on any maps in many middle eastern countries?

Nor Palestine you will say. Fine. But who was living in this land when the occupation came in? No one? Then what are these millions refugees living in camps inside and outside of occupied Palestine? have they fall from sky?

Granted Jews are great debators. I have friends Jew and Arab alike and enjoy arguing with both of them. the truth is anyone can call anyone anything. its all in how you provide proof. the devil is in the details. all i ask is if you say your wrong you can provide clear proof that can survive a rebuttal.

The problem here is that the world is giving Semitism a great deal while in the other hand they condemn discrimination. So what is you are a Semitist? I’m too by the way. I’m a son of Ebrahim (Abraham) too!!!

I do believe that good people exist everywhere and somewhere in gaza a bunch of people are having coffee or tea saying blowing up children in israel is not the right thing to do….however with hamas as the elected governement (elected by the majority of people) having a charter of suicide bombers you can’t really say most people have any simpathy for innocent civilians in Israel. Also note hamas (elected governemnt) does not accept Israels right to exist…

I’m not going to argue the Hamas thing here as I’m not one of their fans. Check out my archive and you can find more. However, I said this before, and I’m saying it again:

1. Hamas was elected not because of their political program and because people believe they are doing the right thing in that front. In fact it is the opposite. Palestinians lost hopes in peace and negotiations with Israel. At the same time, Palestinians were suffering from economical problems and previous government were in office for very long. They were (and still are) corrupted, and the people wanted to get ride of them. The result was Hamas because these people are very well known in there clean hands, financially.

2. Israel does not accept Palestinians right to exist. In fact, until this day, if you go to the Knesset, you will see the map of greater Israel hanging there, from river to river (Egypt to Iraq). So, the question is, what difference does it make if Hamas accept Israel right to exist or not if Israel itself is not accepting the Palestinians right to exist. Forget about the political speeches, look on ground. How can you convince a Palestinian that Israel wants peace and accept his right to exist while every day, more land is stolen and new settlements are built on stolen lands?

All Israelis (to my knowledge) have family in the Army as they have no choice. SO I suppose saying that their parents make them dinner when they come home from the army would make them accomplices to the occupation in a very minor way. However I think you have to ask yourself, if you had a fight with another man in town, should you fight just him or should you kill his mom and cousins too. I believe you meet people head on if you are to fight, you don’t hide behind other people that they would receive any of the fight that they did not start. Any terrorist resistance hides behind regular hardworking people who want peace. this is the biggest problem for palestine. Also the “where did you come from” is very closed minded. the Jews and Arabs have to share the land in a seperate but equal solution. the be honest the best thing would be a country based on no religion and inermarriage of jews and arabs. I suggest they believe in the flying spaghetti monster.

To save your time, read the above home-criminal-occupation-resistance story again. It will answer you.

Occupation has no right to bring anyone to live in the lands he controls. Do you know this law or not? What give Israel the right to else? Nothing. If this apply to everyone, it should include Israelis. So, don’t bring civilians to live in a land which is occupied and you won’t get your family killed. Simple!

the Arab league serves the intrests of the Arab countries that do not accept Israels right to exist. Syria? Iran? . If you were to accept a deal , you’d want to accept a deal that started with we accept your right to exist. Not if you do this and that we will accept your right to exist, but still not want diplomatic relations.

Maybe you should go back and read more about this part.

First, Iran is not an Arab country, so is not part of Arab League.

Second, the Arab peace proposal of 2002 was very clear and fulfil all what Israel claims is a just peace, as well others like what the Palestinians are asking now and the Syrian and Lebanese. So, Syria approved that plan, everyone did, but Israel rejected it. Ask yourself why? They don’t want to return to 1967 borders. They don’t want to give the refugees their RoR, they don’t want to give back the Golan Heights, etc… in other words, they want to keep the situation as is while claiming the victim.

the 2 state solution is the only solution. Think about how long this crap has been going on (and how long it will continue). Israleis need security to control their future, as do the palestinians. Peace comes thru stability. it will take 2>3 generations of living seperate but equal until everyone has forgiven the other for the violent acts of the past. Start the process now and learn to live as good neighbor countries. With all the money the surrounding Arab countries pump into palestine, a peaceful palestine could be a beautiful country.

Thanks!

you should be here to solve the worlds problems. it all starts with the people. you should be here to represent your views and convince others thru peaceful dialog how to fix things.

I do my best, but at the end of the day, I have one major problem called, HOME! have you ever feel that? Have you ever been HOMELESS? Put your self in an uprooted Palestinian shoes, and think for a while. How can you think and do anything but fight for your home first?

Zionism is the same as Black pride, Christian pride, arab pride. its a group of people of one group stating how great it is to be X group. The same way palestinians are proud to be palestinians. and everyone has their own view of it. I think of Zionism as a bunch of Jews who wanted a country (Israel) where they would be allowed to be Jewish without having to be second class citizens. Palestinians want the same thing a free palestine where they can control their fate as free equal citizens. Everyone likes to call out zionism as racism that is jews only. now granted in orthodox sects of any religion this is true (radical islam, judiasm, christianity)..but for most people its just the ability to be who you are without shame or fear. Also releavant to Zionism last I checked Non arabs were not allowed to goto Mecca or many holy places of Islam. Is there a term for places that non islamic humans may not go ?

Zionism is not a religion, is not a tripe, is not a color, it is an ideology which is based on hate and racism.

I’m proud to know more Jews (Israelis and non Israeli) who are not Zionist, and I’m proud of that. But to put Zionist on the same level of NORMAL people, this is a big mistake.

Just remember, we’re all humans and we all like pizza. Its a great starting point for any chance of peace

Peace!

“STOP” UNITED NATION or “REFORM” IT! “

Your comment was never deleted, it was in moderation until you bombarded the comment section with three more comments, which triggered the anti-spam script to identify you as a sapmmer and thus deleted all your comments. I received them from there and now they are back as you can see.

On the other hand, no, blogs are not forums, and this is how I like to keep mine. If a comment is valid (in the eyes of the blog owner), then it is welcome, if not, he have the right to flush it down the drain.

I see you have a very comprehensive comment, which I don’t fully agree with you, and I’ll reply to it later today when I’m back from office. Mean while, help your self in searching the word Zionism in my archive and learn more about my views in this regard. I’m sure it will help you understand more of what is going on here.

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Those of us in the US who give a damn, protest, but the fact is that we have a representative to the UN, John Bolton, who has contempt for the UN and is a contemptible jerk, and a President which 69% of the country distrusts.

Then there’s the fact that we didn’t elect John Bolton, and the fact that the Administration’s done everything it can to marginalize the influence of the UN inside the country, and that Americans fear each other so much now that even legal demonstrations stand a chance of conflict and police action.

We sleep at night because honestly, our country’s politics are screwed up. Our economy is going down — people don’t have enough money to take time off, much less demonstrate for every worthy cause. Those who would execute or support violence of any kind against any institution would be immediately branded traitors and probably terrorists, and jailed or executed based on the magnitude of their crime. Many stay quiet because it is the easier thing to do. Others shout and protest because it is the only thing they can do.

But really, it’s the fear. Fear that not supporting Israel means supporting terrorism. Fear that if Israel can’t hold its enemies back, they’ll come to America. Fear that if someone speaks out, they’ll be punished — either by the law, by extremists, or in some other intangible way. Fear that if they take time off of work to believe in a cause they won’t be able to pay their morgtage. Fear because the government was elected to be representative of the people and yet voter groups skew the turnout while apathetic people forego voting. Rationalization that a bad government is much less fearful than none.

I could rant some more, but won’t. Attack the government all you like — but while I agree that Israel is doing wrong, you can only blame the *people* of the US so much. If it were possible for citizens to refuse to pay the tax dollars funneled to Israel, many of us would choose to do such a thing.